Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing ‘failed’ in the UK (or at least didn’t create a $30m exit)
by Guest Author
on August 13, 2008

US entrepreneurs have had notable success with Blog publishing startups, in particular Jason Calacanis (Weblogs Inc sold to AOL for $25m) and more recently Rafat Ali (Paid Content sold to The Guardian for $30m). Ashley Norris, former co-founder of early UK blog network Shiny Media, left the company last week to create another startup – but there is no multi-million sale yet in sight for Shiny. In this guest post for TechCrunch UK he makes his first public statements on the matter, he rails against the BBC, VCs, ad agencies and pores over why he thinks Blog publishing has had only limited success in the UK. Did Shiny ‘cut the mustard’ or were wider factors at work? You decide.

The last five years have seen an explosion in the number of independent commercial blogs, blog networks and websites in the US. The Huffington Post, Sugar Publishing, Perez Hilton, Gawker Media, Engadget - the list goes on forever, and they are just the Web 2.0 premiership. There are thousands of individuals running less high profile blogs and websites who are making a significant living from their work.

In the UK it is a depressingly different story. I have spent the last five years of my life developing Shiny Media, the largest and most successful UK blog network. When I left the company at the end of August it could boast that over four million people each month were either reading or viewing its content. Shiny Media is however one of a handful of independent UK content companies to attract more than a couple of million monthly readers to its sites. There are some amazing blogs and sites out there, Hecklerspray, Anorak, The Spoiler, Coolest Gadgets, Unreality TV and Pocket-Lint spring to mind, but of those only one can claim more than a million monthly readers.

There have been several attempts to develop a UK based blog network (Mink Media, Blog Nation and Messy Media are the most high profile) but many have crashed just months after their launch.

When I first started seeking investment for Shiny back in 2005 I was constantly told I was wasting my time and that the business would never be worth more than a couple of hundred thousand pounds. Ok, so content was rather unfashionable with VCs back then, and what they told me only served to strengthen my resolve to make Shiny successful, but in retrospect I do think that many of the VCs had quite an accurate take on the difficulties facing any developing independent media companies in the UK.

So three years and lot of water under the bridge later here is my take on why I think the US explosion of new media companies hasn’t been repeated over here.

1 Limited number of UK online eyeballs – The obvious reason why UK new media companies haven’t achieved the same success as their US counterparts is down to economies of scale. US sites have at least five times more readers to aim at and that counts for an awful lot when most online advertising is still based around a CPM model (advertisers pay a between 50p-£20 depending on the campaign per thousand people who see their ad). What makes it even trickier is that most UK advertisers for obvious reasons only want their ads to be seen by UK readers. For most UK blogs and established websites Britons count for between 30-50% of their readership, the rest is from the US and other English language speaking countries. It is possible to monetise non-UK ad inventory but it is generally at much lower rates than the UK inventory. The difficulty for most UK blogs and websites is that they simply don’t have enough UK readers to interest ad agencies and brands, so they are left to monetise even their UK traffic using ads that have very low CPMs.

Perhaps an obvious tactic is to forget about the UK completely. Maybe there is something in the fact that two of the five best read blogs to emanate from the UK – Mashable and Coolest Gadgets – are focussed on a worldwide (in the main, US) audience.

2 Lack of imagination in the ad industry – Shiny has been very successful at attracting blue chip brand advertising (Marks and Spencer, Nokia, Dyson, BMW are among the high profile brands who have advertised on its sites). However it has been a long and slow process convincing agencies and brands to advertise on blogs. In reality it should be simple. The readers of the bigger British blogs (if Shiny and other groups like Glam are to be believed) tend to be young, affluent, educated and spend much more time online than they do imbibing other media. However many brands and their agency planers have chosen to play it safe and will work with established media brands or mega portals like MSN, even when the ads themselves will be seen by a less focussed and often an inappropriate audience. There are signs that this is changing, but the lack of brand advertising on sites like Hecklerspray and Unreality TV really is baffling.

3 Lack of UK media entrepreneurs – As someone who wasn’t involved in a start up in the first web boom largely because I spent all my working hours writing about it for magazines and newspapers, I can understand why there are so few media entrepreneurs in the UK. Many of the smarter journalists are way too busy to develop their own start up and there are very few entrepreneurs outside the media who have the capacity to develop media properties. Ironically many of the most successful, blogs and websites in the UK have been developed by freelance journalists who have worked on their sites in addition to writing for others, and in many instances rival media. This is ideal for slowly building an audience, but the emphasis is on the word slowly.

4 Lack of VC support – As a rule European VCs don’t tend to be too interested in media unless it is supported by a technological innovation. Other than Shiny I can’t think of a single online editorially based media play in the UK that has attracted any sizable investment in the last few years. Before Shiny it was Magicalia Publishing and that was many years ago.

Conversely organisations like Next New Networks , the closest US equivalent of Shiny, has several VCs on its board and has so far attracted over $23m in funding. Established US media has also worked with independent new media companies too. NBC has equity in Sugar Publishing, another Shiny rival, while The Discovery Channel acquired Treehugger the leading green blog.

5 Too much competition – Several commentators have suggested that the explosion in successful blogs occurred largely because Americans distrust established media and see it as being in the pockets of big business. I can’t really comment on the US, but I do know that this isn’t the case in the UK. On the surface Britons appear to be fairly loyal to their newspaper and magazine brands. There have been many examples of offline brands that have been a disaster when launched online, but there are some significant successes now too. Existing media companies have much larger budgets than independents and are now starting a serious land grab in building up their online properties. Just check how often you see a UK media company using a Google Adword. However the independents have in many instances a first mover advantage and often a keener understanding of how to work the web to market a site which has kept them one step ahead of big brands.

6 The omnipotent BBC – At the risk of sounding like a stuck record the existence of the BBC and its hugely impressive range of online services does make life even more tricky for the independents. Going back to point one there is only a certain number of UK web surfers and as the BBC hoovers up a large percentage of them the slice of the cake for the independents is even smaller. Secondly, the BBC’s reluctance to link to British blogs and smaller independent media organisations, while at the same time endlessly plugging established media groups (Five Live is one long plug for mainstream media brands) makes life even more difficult.

On a very basic level, if the BBC didn’t have its huge online football offering, then it is very likely that Shiny’s footy blog, whoateallthepies.tv, which is one of the most read football blogs in the world, would be significantly larger. What is even more galling for the founders of Shiny and other indie media groups is that they personally pay a small amount in the guise of the licence fee to fund what in reality are rival sites.

Were the BBC to take a more enlightened view of British independent and social media it could do a lot to encourage young talent to develop UK media properties thereby greatly enriching British media.

Conclusion

On the surface this probably reads like a fairly negative post. It isn’t meant to be.

I do think that British independent new media companies can develop businesses, Shiny is proof of that as are Trusted Reviews, The Register and Digital Spy, but they have to be so much smarter and work so much harder than their rivals in mainstream media. I think online video will provide an opportunity for UK companies to compete on a worldwide stage, however they will need access to fairly sizable funds to do this.

Finally it is worth adding that the economic downturn might actually provide some interesting opportunities for UK bloggers. Several of the most successful indie websites date from around 2002/2003, a time when mainstream media was pulling out of the web after the dot com crash. It is possible that 2009 will go down as the year in which the third wave of indie media started gaining momentum. Here’s hoping.

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  • Paddy

    The only Shiny blog I subscribe to is TechDigest – and only just in case it has something that isn’t on Gizmodo (US or UK), Engadget or CrunchGear. The content of Tech Digest just isn’t at the same level. For a while I subscribed to their football blog Who Ate All The Pies and their Liverpool FC one Liverpool Pies, but not for very long – the content really was pathetic, and the opinions offered were of the sort of standard you might here over a few beers in the pub. Whatever disadvantages UK blogs face, the lack of quality at Shiny can’t be helping them.

  • Andrew

    Hi Ashley,

    You failed to mention in your article that the Shiny blogs had more flash based advertising than any other blog network that I view. In fact, most of the comments I have encounted relating to the Shiny blogs were to this effect.

    The flash based advertising (up to 7 animated flash adverts on a single page) not only made the blogs unpleasing to look at but they also bloated the sites so much that it pretty much made them unusable (both speed wise and page load wise). Add to this, the RSS feeds which have adverts on most of the posts along with mediafed links which are down quite a bit of the time, and you are starting to see a recipe for disaster.

    Shiny used to be amazing, in fact, the best quality blogs I read… however they lost their way when they moved from the mantra of “content is of upmost importance” to “how much advertising revenue can we make”, and with this, they lost their loyal readership.

    Andrew

  • TomV

    Good to read this on a blog.

  • jklondon

    never read a shiny blog … just tried whoateallthepies.tv …rubblish, the layout presentation and most importantly the content.

  • http://pocket-lint.co.uk Stuart

    As the owner of Pocket-lint I think one of the biggest problems I’ve had over the past 5 years is getting PR companies to change their attitudes into understanding that the internet is just as good a place to be seen as magazines and newspapers.

    What makes this frustrating is that for the most part I have a bigger readership than all the magazines in the UK in my sector and most of their websites, yet the “Play it safe” mentality normally prevails.

    The attitudes are changing with a good majority of agencies waking up to the fact that just because we don’t have an office doesn’t mean we aren’t a professional outfit. But there is not a week that goes by where I don’t have to question a PR company as to why they’ve decided that it wasn’t a good idea to talk to us first. The normal response? “That’s the way we’ve always done it.”

    Until companies start to take independent publishers like myself seriously and not just think Blogging is yet another buzz word to throw into a presentation I feel that the situation is unlikely to change any time soon.

  • http://www.tom-watson.co.uk/2008/08/blog-publishing-in-the-uk-why-it-failed/ Blog publishing failure in UK – are the BBC to blame? | Tom Watson MP

    [...] in the States but failed miserably in the UK. One of the reason given is the omnipotence of the BBC. Other reason given are lack of venture capital support, poor imagination and too few punters. [...]

  • http://www.theredrocket.co.uk/blog/?p=113 » What is the problem with UK blogs? The Red Rocket: Altogether now, “reach for the sky”

    [...] Norris, the founder of Shiny Media, is today’s guest author for Tech Crunch and is ruminating on why the UK lags behind the States when it comes to monetizing the blog [...]

  • http://www.dailyack.com/ Alasdair Allan

    Content is the thing, and shiny doesn’t have it. I read over 250 feeds, none of them are part of Shiny. Sorry, but their content just isn’t very compelling.

    He’s complaining that if the BBC didn’t publish better content for free then his ad-supported content would get pageviews. Doesn’t that mean he should make better content? After all people still watch ITV because it has different (better?) content than the BBC, maybe Shiny should take a leaf out of their book?

  • http://blog.luziaresearch.com Al

    I have only come across shiny when looking at incoming links to one of our sites – they reprinted a press release we did – verbatim. I went to look at the sites and thought they must be part of a spam network and were gaming google in some clever way because the site was full of adverts and what looked like spam.

  • Carol Williams

    I was a fan of Shiny blogs, until the horrendous flash advertising overload started crashing my browser half the time. Now I avoid all Shiny blogs as I simply can’t be bothered to wait for all the advertising to load before I can read two brief sentences of news.

  • Dave Nicholls

    I used to read TechDigest but stopped over a year ago. I’d posted a comment containing a correction to a review and went back a couple of hours later to find the review updated and my comment removed. Comments deserve more respect than that so I never went back.

  • http://chris@shinymedia.com shinychris

    I agree with a lot of the points that Stuart makes. But just to set the record straight that Shiny was never set up to capitalise on the buzz around ‘blogging’, it just happened to use a blogging platform/ethos to deliver high quality content because we thought it was an effective means of reaching our audience – and so it proved. I strongly refute the suggestion that our content isn’t as good as it used to be. In fact I think it is much better than when we couldn’t afford to pay/train decent quality writers. We now have 10 full time journalists and around 40 freelances who are all highly skilled at writing and, increasingly, presenting to camera. Regarding design, I think there is sadly always a trade off between the user experience (ie the reader) and the commercial reality. We don’t have the luxury of the BBC in supporting endless amounts of content at the tax payer’s expense. As a blog network we face issues around having a high number of uniques but lower page impressions per unique which means that we have to put quite a few ads on the page. Over time, as the market matures and advertisers realise the value/size of our audience I think we will see the number of ads per page fall and the user experience improve. Finally, just to make it clear that blog publishing hasn’t failed as your headline states. Shiny continues to go from strength, both in terms of traffic and revenue which have grown substantially in the last 12 months since taking investment from Bright Station Ventures. Chris Price, MD, Shiny Media

  • http://www.t3.com Katherine Hannaford

    In reply to Stuart, who claims “just because we don’t have an office doesn’t mean we aren’t a professional outfit. But there is not a week that goes by where I don’t have to question a PR company as to why they’ve decided that it wasn’t a good idea to talk to us first. ”

    Perhaps it has something to do with the constant breaking of embargoes, lack of outgoing links to the real source, and blatant plagiarism undertaken by your writers (from both press releases, and other sites)?

    To wit, here’s a post on Pocket-Lint – http://www.pocket-lint.co.uk/news/news.phtml/16266/17290/O2-MMS-text-photo-controversy.phtml

    And a post on PC Pro, which Pocket-Lint linked to as a source (for once) – http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/213597/o2-plugs-mms-picture-leak.html

    Now, have a look at the mirrored phrases -

    Pocketlint – ‘after it was revealed that photos sent by MMS can be found using just a simple Google search’

    PC Pro – ‘after it was revealed that photos sent by MMS could be found with a simple Google search.’

    Pocketlint – ‘images can be accessed using a simple InURL search on Google.’

    PC Pro – ‘library of photos could be accessed using a simple InURL search on Google.’

    Pocketlint – ‘The problem was highlighted on dozens of blogs, news websites and even O2 messageboards over the weekend.’

    PC Pro – ‘The problem was highlighted on dozens of blogs, news websites and even O2 messageboards over the weekend.’

    Pocketlint – ‘O2 eventually decided to take the nuclear option and take down the website viewing service.’

    PC Pro – ‘O2 eventually decided to take the nuclear option and take down the website viewing service’

    Pocketlint – ‘Now anyone attempting to view the leaked images is met with an Apache server error message.’

    PC Pro – ‘Now anyone attempting to view the leaked images is met with an Apache server error message.’

    Are you telling me that this is the way to gain the respect you believe blogging, or indeed online publishing deserves, Stuart? The amount of conversations I, along with other journalists, have had with PRs about your publication make it clear to me that the reason you’re not getting “taken seriously” is because you’re breaking all the rules, and giving blogs and online publications a bad name.

    Disclaimer: I used to work at Shiny Media until two months ago when I moved to T3.com, and Pocket-Lint is one of my online rivals for traffic.

  • http://renaissancechambara.jp Ged Carroll

    Another problem is that you are competing against high quality US content. About 75 per cent of the sites in my news reader are from the US or international publishers rather than the UK.

    All readers aren’t created equal, a well defined high value demographic that has smaller overall unique users would represent a good proposition to marketers, particularly on PPC adverts. Its no use having a million readers if they are all part of the nations underclass and would only appeal to JD Sports, debt consolidation companies and lawyers specialising in legal aid.

  • Becca

    I used to read Catwalk Queen and ShinyShiny (which used to be my favourite) and even Hippy SHopper…I liked them when they first started. Then the advertising got to be too much. The content seemed like regurgitated press releases. It didn’t seem fun anymore. It was a great idea and a couple of years ago it was really cool.

    Why don’t you guys care more about your design and your content? Where is the creativity? I am just really disapointed now with them. I’d rather read Sugar even tho they barely have any UK sites.

  • http://paulfwalsh.com/blog Paul Walsh

    Point 6 is absolutely true. The BBC continues to hamper innovation in the startup world.

    I do think there’s a lack of appreciation and experience amongst most PRs when it comes to online, not just the new way in which we converse with the consumer. Note that I didn’t say ‘all’ of them. Clearly there are some PRs who are good at what they do, but like old media, there’s a massive lag and it’s time they caught up.

  • http://blog.luziaresearch.com Al

    Katie who is the Editorial Director from Shiny has asked me provide the verbatim PR post – which I can’t do. Upon checking up as I should have done before making the comment – the actual post was not verbatim.

    The verbatim issues came in that the same post was then posted on 4 or 5 different blogs verbatim – this is what made me think it was a spam network of some sort.

    Sorry for accusing Shiny of verbatim posting press releases – that was not at all true.

  • http://davepress.net/2008/08/13/bookmarks-for-august-13th-from-1143-to-1143/ Bookmarks for August 13th from 11:43 to 11:43 | DavePress

    [...] Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing failed in the UK – Interesting article on TechCrunch UK about the failure of independant blog networks to succeed in the UK [...]

  • Iain

    The design/ads/usability is the major drawback. Looking at the way any shiny site is put together, its clear that they don’t have a clue about online media. It seems from Ashley’s comments that they were trying to align themselves too much with mainstream media, but at the end of the day you’re a website, nothing more. They need to pay the same attention that the rest of the industry pays to areas such as usability, user loyalty, SEO, accessibility, ad placement, market research. New media in the uk has never been stronger and its one of the only industries that hasn’t been hit by the recession.

    Chris, as for the ads, “having a high number of uniques but lower page impressions per unique” this isn’t common to blogs, this is common to sites that don’t work, caused because the users hitting one page then leaving without venturing past the initial landing page. Less ads would lead to more impressions, more loyalty, which would lead to more overall banner impressions, its a clear case of chicken before egg.

    Bottom line, the issues are not industry related, these issues are limited to a company that doesn’t have a clearly defined strategy trying to survive in an industry that it doesn’t understand.

  • http://andymerrett.co.uk Andy Merrett

    I’ll give people the benefit of the doubt (of not trolling) because everyone is entitled to their personal preferences about what constitutes good content etc., but here are my thoughts on “Let’s Bash Shiny” Day

    @Paddy: TechDigest can’t be all that bad all the time because we do get pickups *from* some of the sites you read – guess that’s when they “miss” things eh?

    @Al: The concrete example, rather than a blanket statement about verbatim press release copied from “one of your sites” when Shiny Media publishes thousands of articles each month, would be useful. I’m sure it has happened. If it doesn’t compel you, that’s fine, we can’t cater to everyone.

    @Becca: I take some offence (though not much, as I have better things to spend my energy on) at being labelled as someone who “regurgitates press releases’. (compare: Katherine’s comment). For your information, I spend a significant proportion of each day writing articles. Yes, a number of them are based on press releases (show me any journalist who doesn’t use them) but I do inject commentary, opinion, and context. Maybe not for everyone, but I have connections who are happy to read and interact with Shiny blogs.

    @Dave Nicholls: Again, one example does not a rule make. We work very hard to engage with those leaving comments, as it’s (IMO) an important part of any blog. If you felt you weren’t treated with respect, then I’m sorry. I hope it was more an oversight than an intentional desire to offend.

    Disclaimer: I am a freelancer writing for three of Shiny Media’s technology blogs.

  • Kate Etherton

    It’s an interesting and slightly disappointing post from Stuart. I don’t whole heartedly disagree either, but having worked in PR himself he should know better the workings of a PR agency and the daily struggle they have mediating between in-house people who want one thing, and are under a lot of internal pressure, and people like himself who expect another.

    People love to see their name, company and product in print and it’s only recently, despite banging on for what feels like my entire career, that companies appreciate the reach of online media – and this has only really been highlighted through their use of SEO. Sad but true. So I wouldn’t beat the agency up too much here, you’d be surprised how much goes on behind the scenes that you’re not exposed to, fighting the corner of the online publication (be that blog or otherwise). Although if you’ve ever worked in PR it shouldn’t come as such a surprise.

  • http://andymerrett.co.uk Andy Merrett

    @Al: your second comment came in as I was posting my long retort. Pleased that’s cleared up.

    Additional disclaimer: These are my thoughts as someone working with the company, and not necessarily the viewpoints of the Directors of Shiny Media.

  • http://www.shinymedia.com Katie Lee

    The impression this piece gives is that we set Shiny Media up purely as a company that we wanted to flog to the highest bidder as soon as we possibly could. That certainly wasn’t my motivation – I wanted to create online magazines that were funny, well-writen, interesting and a world away from women’s magazines (and some other print media). I think we’ve achieved that (and I’m sorry that not all the commenters feel the same) and created a great portfolio of really great sites.

    I know it makes for a better story, but the headline and intro you’ve tacked onto this piece is depressingly British. Three journalists set up their own publishing company with no initial investment, attrack Blue Chip advertising and investment, become respected in the industry (we haven’t had a problem being taken seriously by PRs for a while now, but it took time and patience) and continue to go from strength to strength, and yet somehow we’re a failure?

    @Al: We never copy and paste in press releases – unless there’s a good reason for it (eg to highlight how ridiculous they are) – and I’ve contacted you in the hopes that he’ll direct me to the post so I can address it.

    @Dave Nicholls We also usually respond to commenters (unless the comment is rude or aggressive in tone) and I’m sorry if that didn’t happen this time.

  • http://www.broadstuff.com alan p

    Sadly for Shiny, content is still king. The content got worse as the ads proliferated. Also, there is always an 800 lb Gorilla in a sector, whether its Google, Microsoft, or the BBC. C’est la vie. And they are all offset funding themselves in the digital media sector, so there’s no real difference in BBC’s status.

    However, to the bigger issues – there is truth in the points that US outfits are being funded/bought and UK ones are not, and that Ad agencies are being very cautious. Thus, even if one was a “Better than Shiny” its not clear their fate would be much different.

  • http://www.thisfrenchlife.com/ Craig McGinty

    Thanks for that Ashley, very interesting to read of your experiences.

    An area that I’ve seen few blogs, big or small, investigate is alternative income streams such as affiliates – and I don’t just mean the odd banner ad.

    I’ve been dipping my toe into it myself, but it is interesting to think that most successful affiliates struggle to create content, whilst most content creators struggle to draw in any income.

    Maybe the two need to talk together more.

  • http://www.shinymedia.com Katie Lee

    @Al, thanks for clearing that up and sorry that I took so long writing my reply that I didn’t see your second post until after I’d hit publish.

    @Becca, if you’d rather read Sugar sites then I guess there’s not much I can do to fix that – the Sugar team are brilliant, but their writing style is totally different to ours. They talk about their boyfriends a lot, use lots of exclamation marks and are generally more (to steal a Japanese word) “genki” than we are.

  • http://pocket-lint.co.uk stuart Miles

    Katherine,

    Not wanting to turn this into a public slagging match, but not sure where you are getting your claims of blantant plagiarism, lack of outgoing links and constantly breaking embargo claims from.

    Pocket-lint is staffed by professional journalists and is highly respected in the industy. We always credit our soruces, we never break embargoes and pride outselves on being one of the largest tech blogs in the UK bringing our readers fair and honest news daily.

    If you want to discuss your issues with pocket-lint over a beer give me a shout.

    Stuart

  • http://twitter.com/mikebutcher Mike Butcher

    @Katie Lee – On reflection I have moderated the headline and intro to better reflect the tone of this piece. It seems to me that whatever anyone thinks about Shiny specifically, that fact is that they had an extremely good run at trying to create the kind of blog network that, had it been in the US, might have lead to it being bought by a major media owner. The reasons why this business did not create a large “exit” for its founders is worth discussing and I think Ashley makes some very interesting points, hence the piece. It’s also worth noting that the tone of the piece is not at all bitter – it’s a genuine attempt to look at the whole subject. It’s for others to decide if Shiny’s efforts were up to par or not, but frankly, no-one else has had such a long run at creating a pure, UK-specific blog network along the lines of Weblogs Inc / Gawker, and how that model worked (or didn’t) in the UK is fascinating.

  • http://chris@shinymedia.com shinychris

    Iain, It is clear we understand about online media! How can you produce an online network that has millions of unique users and not understand it. Honestly, that is some insult. The issue that we have with the blogging platform is the one that is faced by all other blog publishing networks worldwide. And that is because the linear nature of a blog people typically read seven to 10 stories on the home page, then click through and read the next seven to 10 stories. So they could read up to 20 stories and still only count as two page impressions. This is simply a fact. Until advertisers move away from buying on a page impression (CPM) basis, and understand the opportunities of a huge uniques base, these challenges will remain.

  • Kate from Beam

    FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT

    Disclaimer: I am a PR and I take you all very seriously

  • http://girlygeekdom.blogspot.com Sarah

    I’m not really surprised at the lack of unique hits to page impressions, as some of the other commentors have already said lots of flash is a quick way to lose readers fast. It sounds to me like the site designers need to visit ProBlogger to get a few tips.

    I do agree that focusing on a solely UK market is a flaw for Shiny Media’s growth strategy as it limits their scope hugely. I wonder if they will focus on a wider audience in the future.

    So where to next… well point 6 is very poignient and I have to agree the Beeb doesn’t link out much and even then generally to a limited few bloggers. The question really there for me is what stops them from linking out to other online resources? Is it the lack of integrity of online resources or is there company policy getting in the way.

    It will be interesting to see where the conversation moves to on this topic.

  • http://www.pspsps.tv Al Warmington

    @Dave Nicholls

    “I’d posted a comment containing a correction to a review and went back a couple of hours later to find the review updated and my comment removed. Comments deserve more respect than that so I never went back.”

    I’m extremely sorry to hear that because I think I was doing a lot of the reviews at the time you mentioned. Deleting comments, especially correct and helpful ones, is something that I definitely would not do and is certainly not in Shiny’s policy. It probably doesn’t make a lot of difference now, but sorry all the same.

    @ the content doubters

    Just to add my tuppence worth: regurgitation of press releases is really not what we do. All the people I have worked with on Tech Digest for the last three years have all been committed to writing original and entertaining content that differentiates itself from the vast numbers of other tech sites and blogs out there.

    Like Andy says – and I hope I speak for pretty much all the writers – we use press releases a lot of the time, but to just copy and paste the information is not in the mindset.

  • Andrew

    @shinychris, the point Iain is making about impressions vs uniques is that having high uniques vs relative page impressions means you are not getting return visitors, bascially, people are visiting but then not coming back.

    Shiny’s content is updated regularly enough for each unique to create many impressions per month so if you had loyal readers you would see a considerably higher page impression count compared to uniques visitors.

  • http://www.skimbit.com Alicia Navarro

    Agree with Mike – not sure why everyone has felt the need to voice their opinion on the quality of Shiny Media’s site and content, when the issue being presented very effectively by Ashley is why the VC and PR community in the UK are reluctant to invest/advertise with them or other blog networks, when clearly it IS the most popular blog network in the UK, and gets traffic that is admirable even though they are not a web application that by its very nature is more page impression heavy. Surely we should be congratulatory to one of our own here in the UK who are successful and passionate, even if you ‘think’ you wouldn’t have done the same if you were in their shoes.

  • Becca

    @katie yeah, their writing is different: people actually like it.

  • Iain

    @shinychris I’d be very surprised if the majority of your traffic arrive on your homepage. If your blog is a successful one, 95% of your traffic will arrive at an individual entry, then branch out.

    Your homepage isn’t like a newspaper frontpage, not everyone (most) wont even see it.

  • http://www.broadstuff.com alan p

    @ Sarah its not just the BBC that is sparse with links, the other big UK organs (Guardian etc) are not that different in my observation. Many in the US have the same complaint about US media (MSM and big blogs) being very sparse with links and incestuous to boot. Its part of the way the game is played these days.

  • http://chris@shinymedia.com shinychris

    Thankyou Alicia. I am really not complacent – I think we face challenges around design, stickability etc. – but am really proud of what our small team has achieved with Shiny’s blog network, especially considering it has been done on a fraction of the budget of the Beeb and others (we have just one designer cum developer across 30 sites). I think as a nation we are too quick to build people/businesses up and knock ‘em down (and I speak as someone who used to write about celebs for a living). I think generally as as online community we should be standing together more, rather than bitching among ourselves and we should also be presenting a united front to advertisers who often play it far too safe with their online budgets, not recognising the opportunities that sites like ours and competitors such as Pocket Lint etc. offer.

  • Pauline

    The team running Shiny Media are very good at presenting themselves as the cutting edge of new media in the UK, and it’s a line that traditional media like The Guardian and the Beeb has swallowed whole. To a typical consumer of online media, unfortunately, the blogs are poorly designed, splattered with adverts, and have very little in the way of compelling content (aside from the cleavage shots of the female presenters in the video reviews – a deliberate ploy, perhaps?). It’s no good blaming external factors in the marketplace without taking an honest and critical view of your own performance first.

  • http://www.shinyshiny.tv Susi

    @Pauline: You should see the approval process for the neckline of our t-shirts. Nightmare.

  • http://www.t3.com Katherine Hannaford

    @Stuart Miles: please stop pestering me with your phone calls, I am not going to answer them.

    You are only wasting your time…which could be spent on copying and pasting some more press releases onto Pocket-Lint.

    Here’s an image that was created especially for this lovely occasion (not by me, or anyone here, but by another online publication).

  • http://www.t3.com Katherine Hannaford

    Apologies, TechCrunch seems to have stripped the html for that image – take a look here instead – http://www.flickr.com/photos/clashcityrockerkat/2759942844/

  • Eric E

    @Stuart You say in response to Katherine: “…not sure where you are getting your claims of blantant plagiarism”…

    …how’s about the extensive example of bla(n)tant plagiarism she posted in support of her point? And yes, the Pocket-lint post has an outgoing link to the source. But that doesn’t stop it being plagiarism.

    Eric.

  • Les Nesman

    Pocket Lint posts we have loved #5: “Called the BT Reveal, the idea is that it reveals itself to you, not like a flasher in the park, but more like: ‘Oh that’s a phone’.”

    http://tinyurl.com/5wamlc

  • http://TechRadar.com Patrick Goss

    “@Stuart Miles: please stop pestering me with your phone calls, I am not going to answer them.”

    And her ringtone is upsetting the rest of the office (you see this is my subtle disclaimer that I am editor of TechRadar and sit very near Kat in Future towers)

    I think all of us that have been internet based journalists get frustrated at the perception of online, (just take a look at what’s happening over at Aintitcool who are now at odds with their audience because they have gone from subversive to mainstream and won’t break an embargo on the Clone Wars film http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/opinion-aintitcool-wars-show-how-how-best-sites-wither-451612 )

    Breaking the rules undermines us all and it’s incredibly frustrating to champion the internet as a valid news source (it is) and the home of talented, professional and well-trained journalists (also true), only to have confidence in us all destroyed by sites that wade in and break fairly simple rules, making all of our jobs harder.

    If plagiarism goes on – it’s bad for all of us. If you break embargos – it’s bad for all of us.

    That’s not finger-pointing, by the way, it’s just common sense.

  • http://www.itpro.co.uk Chris Green

    I for one do not subscribe to the “BBC has killed blog networks and independent online media” idea, rather I think the BBC has helped build international audience interest in British internet media overall, not just for bbc.co.uk.

    The BBC is a big, well-resourced media operation, but the scope of its specialist news output (technology, business, entertainment etc) is very narrow, leaving plenty of room for other online media outlets, independent or otherwise, to get noticed and get traffic.

  • http://www.localdatacompany.com Scott Jones

    I like Shinymedia.

    (They’ve never returned my calls or e-mails about working together. gggrrr)

    But, that aside there’s some good content on their sites – although I would avoid the football side of things, look how rivals has died a death.

  • http://www.hecklerspray.com Hecklerspray

    Thanks for the mention Ashley. Some good observations. Personally, I don’t blame the BBC for not having more traffic, though I hear the points raised and do think it should link out more in general. There are however some other, more pressing concerns.

    One of the most serious issues we’ve found in the past year is a reversal in Google News fortunes. I’m a big fan of Google in general, and always loved the breadth and depth of sources on Google News, but since September there has been a real shift in how it promotes top stories. It seems to *massively* favour the bigger publishers now, which I attribute (rightly or wrongly) to the deal it did with AP.

    I reckon about 90% of the promoted stories on Google News now link to the big media publishers. I’d love to hear feedback from other indie publishers on this.

    Because of this change we’ve been focusing more on social media to drive traffic, to offset the fall in Google News referalls (once 100,000+ on a good day). This has allowed us to maintain our traffic figures at c800k-1.1m uniques per month, though it takes a bit more effort.

    From our perspective we’ve never sought out VC or angel money, mainly because I’m a big believer in bootstrapping. This approach has to some degree hindered our ability to quickly invest in better technology, but it also means we own the company outright and are profitable (with no meddling VC types to deal with, demanding scale!).

    We will get into bed with the right partner, at some stage. We have had a number of approaches from big media groups in the UK and US in the past year, so it is possible to get on the acquisition radar without doing the VC thing. We’re biding our time as I think there’s a lot of room for growth at Hecklerspray.

    The key to developing a blog is *unique content* and a *clear voice*, plus *SEO skills* (both technical and content-orientated). Our design is very lo-fi, so we’ll be making improvements in the coming months: we’ve outgrown WordPress (which is excellent for starting out) and are currently developing a new Ruby-powered publishing platform. We’ll be testing this on a new sports site, due for launch in the next few weeks, before migrating Hecklerspray. I may raise a flag on that Mike as and when ; )

    On the US thing, well, we publish UK stories late morning and then shift to a US focus in the afternoon / early evening. Like all UK publishers we have always had a high percentage of US readers – between 55%-70%. We have US-based writers and I probably receive 100-150 press releases *every day* from US-based PRs. Most of our revenue is derived from the US, and I had five advertiser enquiries out of the blue yesterday… all based in the US. We know which side (of the Atlantic) our bread is buttered on.

    That’s pretty much an overview of where we’re at.

    Shiny has done a great job of building out its business and making some noise in the mainstream press (I don’t think we’ve yet issued a press release), and other indie sites like Pocket-Lint seem to be doing really well. It’s pleasing to see, from somebody who remembers the time when online media was about as in demand as 4-year old matured and cured dogshit.

    Chris @ Hecklerspray.com

  • http://www.buy-our-honeymoon.com/ Andrew G

    FWIW, Bridalwave.tv (another Shiny blog) has remained pretty consistently excellent for years now, and seems to me to be the only UK-based wedding blog to have gained any traction internationally. I’ve only just noticed that it no longer seems to allow comments on its entries, though. Is that a new editorial policy?

  • Iain

    @Hecklerspray Excellent comment and congratulations on outgrowing wp, i respect any site that has the courage (or skills) to roll their own platform.

  • http://www.mychemicaltoilet.com StuartW

    @Andrew G – the lack of comment functionality on Bridalwave is an unfortunate technical issue which we’re hoping to have fixed soon. Hope you’ll stick with the site in the meantime…

    Stuart
    Shiny Production Editor

  • http://chris@shinymedia.com shinychris

    Andrew, Thanks for the kind words. It’s just a technical issue (problem with spam comments). We are trying to get comments back up and running as soon as possible. Just bear with us.

  • Oliver Meakings

    I’d be interested to know the context of this rant.. what are the “flat” content websites (in niche areas like the shiny blogs) that are generating significant revenues?

    Is it a problem with the blog format and the way it delivers to the user, which is obviously ideal for the way people use the web, or is it a reflection of the quality of the shiny blogs themselves?

  • BEM

    Very interesting post (and discussion).

    However, I can’t help but feel (like some others) that the big issue being ignored here is the quality of the (current) writing. Talking about Shiny as a whole is slightly misleading, as each Blog is radically different; a couple are clearly quite decent, but many (e.g. Shiny Shiny, the Pies sites, Techradar etc) just simply aren’t very good.

    IMHO looking at pure visitor traffic is misleading; it’s readership engagement that matters. Look at the number of comments posted on entries. Usually zero, or a mere handful at best. Compare to Engadget in the US, or even Trusted in the UK, where a healthy debate and sense of community exists – there’s not really much of a comparison, so something clearly isn’t working the way it should at Shiny.

    So if it’s a struggle to pull in the marketing cash that’s an issue, then perhaps there are more fundamental challenges than an unlistening industry that just doesn’t ‘get it’. Advertisers (and PRs) have many faults, but spotting a marketing opportunity is not one of them.

  • http://andymerrett.co.uk Andy Merrett

    Sorry to be pedantic, BEM, but Tech Radar isn’t part of Shiny Media.

  • BEM

    Ah – good spot – I of course meant Tech Digest

  • http://andymerrett.co.uk Andy Merrett

    Yes of course you did BEM. :)

    You see, we have to be good at proof-reading, for when the press releases we copy have typos in…

    Oh, damn. :-p

  • Mic

    Stuart Miles hasn’t got a leg to stand on – his site consistently publishes press releases verbatim, claims exclusives it didn’t get and plagiarises other sites. The reason Pocket-Lint is viable is down to his mercenary tactics and, to be fair, a very astute grasp of SEO. To claim he (or any of his writers) are pro-journalists stretches credulity to breaking point.

  • http://www.stuartdredge.com Stuart Dredge

    I won’t get into the mudslinging stuff, but one thing I noticed when at Tech Digest was the un-level playing field when it came to online promotion. A lot of the ways to drive traffic to blogs are US-focused.

    Take Digg for example – at the time, it was driving a lot of traffic to tech blogs, but mostly to US tech blogs. Whether that’s because Digg users were mostly patriotic Americans, or because those blogs were ahead of us when it came to getting their stories Dugg, or something else, I don’t know.

    The other thing, of course, is that the big US blogs we were competing against (Engadget and Gizmodo mainly) were much better resourced than us, with big teams (including interns), and at the last CES, proper big broadcast cameras and people holding boom mics.

    None of this is to rag on those US blogs, mind. Those of us from Shiny met up with Gizmodo for beers at CES this year, and they were really nice. It’s just the only level we could realistically compete with them was on units-of-alcohol-per-blogger, which doesn’t bring in the VC cash ;o)

  • http://www.stuartdredge.com Stuart Dredge

    One more thing, I think the way to build any sort of British blogging industry is not to turn on each other like angry cats in a sack…

  • http://andymerrett.co.uk Andy Merrett

    Quite right, Stuart. I’m more into turning on the (ex / non) readers ;)

    OK, I’m going to stop now before I really get myself into trouble.

  • Mic

    Not turning on each other like cats in a sack? Now where’s the fun it that.

    To be honest, I think there are sites out there that are kicking arse and taking names while still sticking to the rules – step forward Electricpig.

    I’m out of the tech game now but in terms of new sites that are really making waves the ‘pig boys have got the right idea.

    (Disclaimer: I think James Holland is a stand-up sort of chap)

  • http://www.johnsumser.com/2008/08/13/080813-daily-links-august-13-2008/ 080813 Daily Links for Recruiters (August 13, 2008) | johnsumser.com: Recruiting News and Views

    [...] Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing ‘failed’ in the UK (or at least didn’t create a $30m… Social media doe not work the same way in all cultures [...]

  • http://pocket-lint.co.uk stuart Miles

    It’s a shame that while I know both Mic and Kat from within the industry they feel that they have to pick fault with Pocket-lint so openly and with such bile almost as if they were trying to start a fight in a bar or play the bully in the school playground.

    There are plenty of examples that I could give whereby both don’t practice what they preach however I don’t want to drop to their level.

    Guys, I’m sorry you feel the way you do about Pocket-lint, we all have our own opinions, people we like and don’t, but lets stick to the context of the post.

    You might not be, but I am very proud of Pocket-lint and what we’ve achieved in the last five years.

    Setting up a website, let alone an industry leading website, has been no easy task and I think that’s what Ashley and Shinychris’s comments have tried to say in the post(s) above.

    At what point it became a Future/Haymarket/Bauer bashing of independent media I’m not sure, but lets not be childish about this.

    We are all grown up enough that we should be working to take on the American’s as an online community to build a UK scene rather than as Stuart Dredge puts it turning “on each other like angry cats in a sack.”

  • http://www.techaddress.com/2008/08/13/an-insiders-look-at-blogging-in-the-uk-he-forgot-the-most-important-element/ An Insider’s Look at Blogging in the UK; He Forgot The Most Important Element  »TechAddress

    [...] Norris, former co-founder of UK blog network Shiny Media has a guest post on TechCrunch where he discusses the UK blogging scene. Ashley left the company last week to create another [...]

  • http://www.colvey.com Scott Colvey

    There’s plenty wrong with Pocket-lint. But then there’s plenty wrong with pretty much any other news site folks might choose to focus on; let alone tech-news sites, where awfulness is the norm.

    So, at risk of sounding quite unlike my old self, take a look at what Stuart Miles has built in five years. Editorially, Lint has lots of FAIL but he has built a well-known brand, despite it having a rubbish name, and from nothing. I have no idea how he managed it but manage it he did and for that alone, he gets my respect. And as for breaking embargoes? Well, if he does – I don’t read Pocket-lint – then good on him. News is about disseminating information. Those who toe PR lines do their readers a disservice.

    (Disclaimer: I have no recent association with Stuart Miles, though years ago I did once walk down a street with him as he babbled on to me about a silly little tech-blog thing called, er, Pocket-lint.)

  • http://discovering-the-starfish.de/2008/08/13/links-for-2008-08-13-deliciouscom/ links for 2008-08-13 [delicious.com] at Discovering the Starfish

    [...] TechCrunch UK » Blog Archive » Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing failed in the UK (tags: socialmedia business) [...]

  • http://www.trustedreviews.com Riyad

    I keep getting emails from people linking to this page and asking me why I haven’t joined in the ‘debate’ – so, what the hell, why not.

    First up let me say that I have a lot of time for Ashley, and a lot of respect for what he built. Building something from nothing is never easy, especially when you’re competing against multinational publishing empires, where executive expense accounts are often larger than your annual turnover!

    Much of what he’s written is right on the money. There is a limited amount of UK traffic, and it was also a serious struggle a few years back to convince any company that online advertising was a better bet than paper. However, I’m not completely convinced of the claim that the BBC has a detrimental effect on independent media, and insists on only plugging established media brands. Perhaps the BBC website doesn’t link out to many UK independents, but when it comes to TV and Radio, the BBC is more than happy to turn to journalists from independent publications for expert comment, and will always give a decent plug to said publication.

    But as Ashley says at the end, ‘British independent new media companies can develop businesses’ and this is a very important point, but even more important is his observation that those businesses have to ‘be so much smarter and work so much harder’ than established media. Five years ago I was working 18 – 20 hour days to build my publication, because I simply didn’t have the resources to do it any other way, and that went on for several years. In some respects I know that my willingness to put in those hours was an advantage, knowing full well that the big publishers weren’t putting that effort in. The driving factor for me was that I truly believed that I could do a better job of creating an online technology publication than any of the major publishing houses, a point that I feel I proved.

    I’m surprised that there are comments here suggesting that PRs don’t take online media seriously, because I simply don’t find that to be the case. Even when I was launching TrustedReviews I didn’t have too much trouble getting kit through the door, because I had been dealing with pretty much every technology company during my years working as a paper technology journalist. To suggest that even now PRs are reluctant to support online publications is puzzling to me – in fact many agencies are of the opinion that online should get the first bite of the cherry due to the potential expediency of publication.

    Gaining the support and respect of the industry (whatever that industry may be) isn’t something that happens over night, especially if you don’t have the backing of an established media empire behind you. That said, as with most industries, media is about person to person relationships, and once those relationships are forged it shouldn’t really matter if you’re writing for a daily or a startup online publication.

    For me though, the immediacy of online publishing is both its greatest benefit and its biggest weakness. Unfortunately some are of the opinion that the most important thing is being first with a story/review, and all too often we see substandard articles published in a desperate effort to slap ‘Exclusive’ on the top of the page. Often I’ve seen so called ‘full reviews’ appear on websites, when I know for a fact that the writer in question has spent less than five minutes with the product at the launch event the previous evening! I even remember attending a Press event in Monaco and then the following day seeing a ‘full review’ written by someone who had never even seen the product, because he didn’t attend the briefing – clearly writing the story from the spec sheet and hoping to hoover up some cheap traffic. It’s this kind of behaviour that seriously undermines online journalism and adds weight to the established media’s claims of being ‘proper’ publications.

    Finally Ashley makes an interesting point about there, perhaps, being a third wave of independent online ventures due to the current gloomy economy. It’s true that many of us kicked our respective titles off at the point where the big publishers were wary of launching websites, but I think that this time around things will be very different. As the economy suffers and publishers cut back, launching online publications is a far less risky proposition than paper, since the cost of launch is exponentially lower.

  • Mic

    Stuart,

    I cannot dispute that you have built a successful business but should note that a) you may know of me from the industry you have never engaged me in conversation in even basic politeness b) my opinions are mine alone and not of my current or previous employers. I have been frustrated for some time with your mercenary approach and challenge you to name one example of me not practicing what I preach during my time as a journalist. I directed criticisms at your website and professional approach, you attacked me and Kat’s personal ethics. Time for a media law refresher?

  • Simon M

    Having been on the inside (to some extent) of Shiny Media for some time (I’m now out – we parted company when my costs and their budgets didn’t match), I’ve found this a fascinating debate to watch. My two-penny-worth? Much as Shiny should be lauded as one of the few Brit blogging empire contenders, there was much messed up in the organisation internally that held it back too. Perhaps this was a symptom of a company going from nothing to major league status way, way too fast. And hopefully it is all getting fixed now, and I wish ‘em all the luck going forward. But I don’t think Ash is right in blaming the BBC and VCs for Shiny’s problems. Hence the stuff below. I also think Shiny’s history is a valuable lesson for anyone following. I’ve said all of this to the founders anyway, so don’t see a problem with saying it publicly, and it’s all evident from the sites anyway:

    1. They grew number of sites too fast (1) – with limited IT support, too many “temporary” problems were left to fester – sites without comments for donkeys, sites without RSS feeds for even longer etc. This also saw necessary redesigns kicked into long grass.

    2. They grew number of sites too fast (2) – there was little or no editorial understanding, vision or control from higher up the chain for the section I was working in (videogames). This meant no nurturing from above. Sure, I know videogames and videogames writers seriously, but I’d be the first to admit I’m no blogging expert – more could and should have been done to pass information round, keep in touch with each other (tougher with offsite freelancers and onsite writers in all sorts of positions). I know other sections felt similarly – in short, the founders and management were spread far too thinly – trying to juggle too much of VC chasing, money management staff turnover and what editorial control they could muster at once.

    3. Money management – while Stuart Miles still works from a home-office, Shiny got, well, fairly shiny offices in Holborn. I don’t know the rent they pay (or don’t). But while that may have looked good for the VCs, too often I felt Shiny spent the wrong money in the wrong places. And I think it may have been wiser, in the long run, to have stayed in home offices – it even looks a bit better, like you’re thrifty.

    4. Editorial quality – I have never had a conversation with anyone other than Ash from Shiny on the quality of posts on the games sites. That should say it all really. Shiny, in my experience, was not as aware as it should have been about editorial quality. It’s something I tried to drum into the games writers (and I think partially succeeded in). But it’s also an endemic problem among semi-pro blogs, particularly UK ones – posts lack angle, simply regurgitate press releases and don’t add anything to the froth of similar news posts already up. This has to change, and fast, if UK blogs ever want to rival the US.

    5. Fad-ism – Up the number of posts, cut the number of posts, more video, no video, new site designs, no site designs etc. Shiny lurched in several different directions in my years there. Now, this could be my semi-external (freelance, working from home) perception of either a game-plan I wasn’t aware of, or of external forces I couldn’t see. But to me, it smacked of again founders spread too thinly, and too little thought/planning in terms of realistically moving forward.

    6. Communication – often non-existant (one year I wasn’t invited to the Shiny party!) and only one-sided. Despite being hired on as a games expert, it was rare I was consulted on games-related decisions etc. Again, all this is fairly typical of what-goes-wrong-with-start-ups. And again, if you’re looking for reasons why a company maybe didn’t make the massive success people thought it might, then this is just one of many reasons.

    7. The books – I’m guessing on this one, but in the scramble to survive/grow, I don’t feel ad revenue and boosting it got much of a look-in in the early days. So, while the sites went from strength to strength on google rankings or hits, I’m guessing the company didn’t make much money on paper. These were the years when there were big companies (Murdoch etc.) sniffing around blogging. This was the moment when big money deals could have been made in the UK. As it was, most big media companies sniffed, saw books that didn’t add up for them, and decided to build their own in-house teams instead. Shiny’s threat is not really the beeb, I don’t think on that basis – but the Futures, Bauers, ITVs, Foxes etc. – trad media companies with money and time to build content and eat away readers. And trad media companies with reputations (true or not) for editorial integrity, accuracy, safety. And with great big ad-selling arms to boot!

  • http://www.bulentyusuf.com Bulent Yusuf

    I used to freelance for Shiny, writing and editing for WiiWii.tv, so I reckon I’m entitled to make a comment here.

    Simon Munk was my editor on the games blogs (WiiWii.tv, PSPSPS.tv, xboxer.tv), and he gave me the creative freedom to write whatever I liked, no matter how tenuously related to the scope of the blog. He also used his considerable clout to open up doors that were otherwise closed to us humble bloggers, and we went on lots of PR jollies with the caveat that we bagged an exclusive or two and stirred up some controversy. And we did.

    At the same time, the Shiny Production Guru Stuart W. gave me permission to tinker with the backend of the site, and for the most part I managed not to break anything. With his help I implemented loads of cool features that encouraged our readers to return, and I learned stuff about this web malarky I wouldn’t otherwise have picked up just by writing and editing.

    Thanks to the two people mentioned above (and not forgetting the contributions of Kat H. and Stuart D.), we managed to double the stats for WiiWii in a matter of months. If it wasn’t for other commitments I might still be working on that site, and gor blimey only knows how much higher we could’ve gone.

    My point, in a long rambling roundabout way, is that Shiny – and by extension the UK blogging scene – is still fresh and vibrant. There may well be a general lack of megabucks funding and resources, but we’ve still got the ideas and the talent to carry us through. Now, how about a group hug?

  • http://www.MessageSpace.co.uk Team MessageSpace

    We watch Shiny with close interest since we are a blog advertising network and in the same space, if not a direct competitor (we do politics and we are happy to let Shiny do their thing).

    Our audience is older, affluent, politically engaged and generally a broadsheet type audience. Our mainstays are political advertising, public affairs issues advertising and advertising from campaigners and people who want to influence the powerful in Westminster.

    We are trying to develop are consumer advertising relationships (all those ABC1s) so far that area is going slowly. But we have had some blue chip advertisers and we pitch media buyers daily. Some are “getting it” soon their end clients will too.

    We have been operationally profitable since our second year (2007) and have no burn rate, so we are not desperate for VC funding. We had seed funding from one investor in the beginning and they are patiently supportive.

    Shiny and MessageSpace are not comparable on a like for like basis. We are not publishers, we nurture publishers and sell advertising on a revenue share model – like federated Media in the US.

    Here is my take on the issues

    1 Limited number of UK online eyeballs: not something we will worry about until we have sold every advertising spot available. Ours is however a premium audience, not a mass audience.

    2 Lack of imagination in the ad industry: it is our job to educate the media buyers. They are not paid to have an imagination. They are paid to get an ROI.

    3 Lack of UK media entrepreneurs: yes totally agree, suspect actually that has a lot to do with the BBC monolith crowding out the private sector. It is hard for entrepreneurs to compete with a massive not-for-profit that has £3 billion in subsidy a year.

    4 Lack of VC support: not sure that is true for the right proposition. We had an off the street offer in our second month. We were in a position to turn them away and we won’t go for a second round of funding until we have reached our revenue targets.

    5 Too much competition: it is tough. I suspect some of our publishing partners will be bought by traditional media brands. One has already, others have had offers. Am happy to say we still sell advertising for them.

    6 The omnipotent BBC: totally agree.

  • Carol Williams

    Mr Miles, you’ve been called out publicly for plagiarism.

    I don’t think anyone will accuse you of stooping to any lows if you address the allegation and example provided.

    Or are you, like all amateur online journalists, simply ignoring facts that don’t fit with your viewpoint?

    And has Shiny Media gone bust or something? You’re all talking like the PCs and desks are up on eBay already.

  • http://www.bunder.com Leslie Bunder

    Ashley makes a great point about the third wave of sites coming in 2009. This will be the ones who have learnt the lessons, both editorial and commercial of how to run a successful online operation.

    Too many ideas have been launched because it is easy these days to do so without thought going into how it will atleast cover its costs if not make some money.

    Also, there are and have been too many also-rans with everyone launching tey another varient of a dozen or so existing sites/blogs out there. Eg: gadgets. Unless your got a unique spin you can put on your site/blog, why do it? Your readers will just see you as an also ran, if you are lucky enough to get any readers coming to you.

    We are still in the very early stages of learning how all this great technology actually works and how it can cover its costs and more importantly learning that even though your site is in the UK and may be aimed at a UK audience, you cannot and should never underestimate the amount of US traffic you may end up with or indeed other countries.

    One other thing I have noticed, when certain sites/blogs claim to be getting millions of page impressions and equally high number of unique visitors why are the comments posted on these sites/blogs for each entry either very low or none at all. Has anyone done any research into the quota of postings verus commens and come up with some numbers of what it should be?

    Roll on 2009 and interesting to note how this posting by Ashley seems to have generated record numbers of comments for Techcrunch UK.

    Mike, get Ashley in as a more regular poster!

  • http://www.bigmouthstrikesagain.com Gary Marshall

    Can a passing freelance/blogger add his tuppence from the perspective of a voracious blog reader? Well, I will anyway.

    To take just one blog as an example, I’m on a bit of an iphone kick at the moment, and I think Shiny’s iPhonic blog is a disaster. Not because of the writer(s) – I know Andy Merrett’s writing of old and he’s good – but because it doesn’t seem to have an identity. It’s like a precis of TUAW and iLounge, which would be fine if TUAW and iLounge didn’t exist. There’s no distinct voice, no campaigning (there’s a big story brewing with the 3G problems, but it doesn’t seem a priority on iPhonic), nothing I can’t get from the US sites other than grief from my wife. And I mean that literally, because when I visit the front page I have to dive for the volume controls as an invasive flash ad blasts out. Not great when the baby is in bed.

    I just don’t see what the USP is. It’s not a UK blog, it’s not a consumer blog, it’s not a developer blog, it’s not a business blog, it’s not a funny blog, it’s not a vituperative blog, it’s not a “what does this all meeeeeeaaaaan?” blog. What does it offer that I can’t get from Daring Fireball, Real Dan Lyons and speed-reading Engadget and TUAW? The competition isn’t the beeb, it’s the other blogs that *do the same thing better*.

    I feel the same way about shiny in general (with the possible exception of Idiot toys) as I do about iPhonic. There are some good writers there, but I don’t feel that the network (in tech stuff at least) delivers anything I can’t get by subscribing to the big name, generally US, sites. Whereas something like, say, Rock Paper Shotgun has a distinct voice and a compelling reason to come back day after day. To me, blogs such as iPhonic feel as they’re there to serve ads, not readers.

    Simon M nailed it when he said: “it’s also an endemic problem among semi-pro blogs, particularly UK ones – posts lack angle, simply regurgitate press releases and don’t add anything to the froth of similar news posts already up. This has to change, and fast, if UK blogs ever want to rival the US.”

  • http://www.bigmouthstrikesagain.com Gary Marshall

    @leslie:

    “Unless your got a unique spin you can put on your site/blog, why do it? ”

    Damn, you said in one sentence what I spent about ten minutes typing :)

  • http://joannageary.wordpress.com/2008/08/13/links-for-2008-08-13/ links for 2008-08-13 « Joanna Geary

    [...] TechCrunch UK » Blog Archive » Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing failed in the UK Ashley Norris, former co-founder of early UK blog network Shiny Media, left the company last week with no sale in sight. In this guest post for TechCrunch UK he makes his first public statements on the matte (tags: business blogging bbc) [...]

  • http://weblog.blogads.com/1537/uk-blogs-fail-financially Blogads for opinion makers » Blog Archive » UK blogs fail financially

    [...] an interesting dissection of the absence of a blogging bubble in the [...]

  • http://andymerrett.co.uk Andy Merrett

    HI Gary,

    Thanks for the personal vote of confidence in me, even if iPhonic isn’t hitting the spot for you at present.

    One of the issues, which Chris has already mentioned, is the current technical difficulties with the commenting system. Believe it or not, this is quite a pain as a blogger. It certainly eradicates trolls, but it also kills the decent interaction with readers.

    I’m aware that sometimes I am simply publishing basic news stories. However, it is a blog about the iPhone (Shiny Media launched it before the first iPhone was announced) meaning we have been dedicatedly reporting news, as well as offering features and opinion, for quite some time.

    When comments return, it’ll be easier to have a good debate about the major topics surrounding the iPhone. That’s one thing which I believe makes blogs great, and I’m missing it.

    There’s definitely more to come from iPhonic, as from all of Shiny’s blogs. As with any site, it’s not going to be for everyone, but I am passionate and knowledgeable about the subject and I always aim for that to come across in the content.

    Having said all that (and stepping back to within a stone’s throw of the original subject) there are a number of US-based technology sites who also “just report the news”, arguably in less detail and with little commentary, as the mainstay of their content, with perhaps a few glib comments thrown in for good measure. I don’t really see a USP there. What they do have is a vast following and enviable resources.

    What needs to be borne in mind – though this must never be used as an excuse for not striving to deliver the best content we possibly can both as individuals and sites / networks – is that readers’ personal tastes will always play a significant role. Look at the volume of vitriolic comments on any large US blog (not just technology-related ones, though they’re a prime example) directed at the writers – for choice of subjects, alleged bias, methods of reporting, even typos – and you’ll see that poplar sites also have even more vocal detractors.

    This has gone way off tangent, for which I apologise, but as I was mentioned personally, I felt obliged to respond.

  • http://www.contextured.com Mike Oxley

    What are you doing next Stuart, what will your 2009 comeback look like?

  • Simon M

    Andy Merrett: “there are a number of US-based technology sites who also “just report the news”, arguably in less detail and with little commentary, as the mainstay of their content, with perhaps a few glib comments thrown in for good measure. I don’t really see a USP there. What they do have is a vast following and enviable resources.”

    US PRs often get stories first, so US journalists break ‘em first. US sites are often far better resourced than UK sites. US sites can therefore afford to be just big, dumb newsfeeds. And by sheer number of posts, weight of links, number of exclusives they will build their audience. Independent blog publishers cannot really take them on at that game, and shouldn’t be so stupid as to try. We have to be much smarter and find a unique voice that attracts a loyal readership that likes our blogs for what we say and how we say it, not for what news story we’ve jumped onto this morning.

  • http://www.stuartdredge.com Stuart Dredge

    @Mike Oxley – too many Stuart’s on this thread ;o) – which one did you mean?

  • http://andymerrett.co.uk Andy Merrett

    @SimonM: absolutely. I wasn’t trying to use it as an excuse for simply pumping out the news because they often do it that way.

  • Major Publisher

    (Stuart’s been trying to offload Pocket Lint onto the big publishers for about a year now)

    Agencies don’t take blogs – individual or network – seriously unless you do a double first job of quality sales representation, consistent and ongoing. But it is definitely possible to turn them around, and get premium CPMs. Inhouse sales representation is absolutely crucial for this, it will never happen via the ad networks, who over the next couple of years will all die anyway to be replaced by publisher networks, both individual and collaborative.

    As an earlier poster said, agencies want RoI; but they will settle with, for many clients, a decent brand/positioning statement, premium sales representation, and clear design coupled with strong advertising share of voice.

    Shiny have failed on all of these points.

    (And their tech video is atrocious – tits ‘n’ tech is not the way to go unless you are Maxim or FHM. People are smarter than that. Just compare with the videos of the major tech publishers.)

  • Walter

    stuartdredge, i’d like to know what you’re doing too. more games or more gadgets!?! :)

  • Agency guy

    Shiny’s most successful blogs in terms of traffic cover the subjects of fashion and football, neither of which are of particular CPM value (as opposed to cars, or tech for instance).
    From a monetisation point of view, the head is of low value and the long tail too fragmented. If it is to take money out of the marketplace.Shiny needs to consolidate, have fewer, more focused blogs that are around areas of vertical market value. This is something IPC, Bauer, CNET and Future realised long ago – you have to build traffic where the money is, not build traffic and expect money to come to you.

  • http://www.solicitr.com Niche Publisher

    This post is a tad depressing,

    just started a little publishing outfit for the legal commnuity.

    But [Agency guy] has given me some hope.

    thanks for your thoughts though.

    http://www.solicitr.com

  • http://outwithabang.rickwaghorn.co.uk Rick Waghorn

    I’ve never been on a Shiny blog; apologies.

    I have, however, been running a football content network for the last two years – out of http://www.myfootballwriter.com – and have built our own advertising network platform to service our local advertisers and get us out of Google’s grip. So have a bit of experience…

    And content is king.

    Because, for us, the future value lies in the content syndication of scarce media – ie exclusive quotes from a Press conference – not fan opinion. However articulate.

    The trick then is to prove value by proving you were ‘at source’; first to the quote… how do you do that?

    By hoping and praying that Sir Tim Berners-Lee latest web project – funded by $350,000 worth of Knight News funding – does what it says it should on the side of the tin…

    http://outwithabang.rickwaghorn.co.uk/?p=73

    Organise that elegantly enough; get scale, supplement local advertising with national advertising and sell the content twice – once ‘locally’ into say http://www.bbc-local.co.uk/norfolk and once ‘globally’ into, say, http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/championship and then find an affiliate model that works – eg train tickets to away games – and you’re getting somewhere….

    Now explain any of that to a bank, to NESTA, or indeed a VC who doesn’t see the word ‘social’ attached to the media format you propose… and all you’re left with going forward is selling chunks of equity off; or trying to sell yourself into an old media house whose world is collapsing…

    It’s tough; very tough. But hats off to anyone who walks the walk.

  • http://outwithabang.rickwaghorn.co.uk/?p=123 The state of the UK’s blogging nation makes for a very, very interesting read. » Out With A Bang
  • http://www.jonnytokyo.com/2008/08/shiny-who/ Shiny Who? — Jonny Tokyo

    [...] co-founder of early UK blog network Shiny Media wrote a guess post on TechCrunchUK entitled “Why blog publishing ‘failed’ in the UK”. Trashing oh sorry discussing why blog publishing houses are failing in the [...]

  • Agency guy

    Best of luck Rick. But affiliate won’t pay the way unless your users really help out. UGC can be a good thing if you have a system of elevating the best users to the top – it’s free, it’s volume and it builds community. You’ll have trouble syndicating to the newspapers.

    Niche publisher – you have a good chance. thelawyer.com does very well, despite an antiquated publishing system. Lots of room there.

  • http://renaissancechambara.jp/2008/08/15/links-of-the-day-96/ renaissance chambara | Ged Carroll – Links of the day

    [...] TechCrunch UK » Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing ‘failed’ in the UK (or at least didn… [...]

  • http://amazon.co.uk not_commenting_to_promote_my_ego

    plagiarism ???

    you are all idiots who add nothing to this world, just rewrite the same old news over and over again.

    Yawn …

  • http://shorttermmemoryloss.com James

    I’m pleased to see other people noting Shiny’s generally terrible level of design. Even when you’ve waited up to a minute for the page to load all the advertising – which occupies more than half of each blog’s screen real estate – you then have to struggle to read. I’ve actually talked to staff about this (a specific example: using Arial Narrow as a body font on http://mychemicaltoilet.com/) but have been met with incomprehension. If you’re not going to listen to your readers, you don’t deserve to succeed.

  • Nicholas Bond

    I think it’s funny that bloggers want to be taken seriously, yet when they reply to the threads and posts on this forum/discussion, lots of their responses are littered with mistakes and typos.
    That says it all, really. Some of us went to journalism college – and learnt how to write and spell. And then we worked on papers and magazines….
    We didn’t just buy a nice new iBook, download some software, bore people with our self-obsessions and copy press releases.
    Just a thought…..

  • Another Agency Guy

    The most fundamental problem with Shiny as alot of people have said is that the sites are absolutely appalling; ugly, poor layout, poor design, bad fonts. They could be knocked up in a couple of hours on typepad.

    They look incredibly amateurish compared to their US equivalents.

    You can’t blame money for this – it wouldn’t take much cash or time to get in proper designers. Also if I remember rightly they got quite a significant investment from Bright Station Ventures, more than enough to pay for a few redesigns.

    This is why advertisers stayed away – there are too many good options for Shiny to get a look in and all offering better content. You can’t charge a premium CPM with what was on offer.

    That and the fact that their sales team was so appalling arrogant that every single media buyer they met at my agency walked out of the meeting, with them swearing that they would never spend a penny at their door.

    They should look in house before blaming the BBC.

  • http://outwithabang.rickwaghorn.co.uk Rick Waghorn

    Agency guy

    Already trialled a feed into the Telegraph this summer; likewise had the conversation syndicating ‘sideways’ too… market and appetite is there… it’s the scale that’s the issue… how anyone – and that includes Trinity, Johnston et al – provides a content-provider model that is, say, 24 Championship clubs strong.

    UGC? When you work such a local ‘beat’ having 000s of anonymous posters saying that D Huckerby was this, that or the other and then expecting Hucks to give me an interview afterwards doesn’t work… they would see the distinction between me and my unmoderated community.

  • http://www.here.org.uk/2008/08/why-blog-publishing-in-the-uk-has-failed.html Why blog publishing in the UK has “failed”

    [...] 11 months ago I asked where are all the good UK blogs? Now, almost a year later Ashley Norris the former founder of UK blog network Shiny Media wrote a piece on TechCrunch on why he thinks blog publishing in the UK has failed. [...]

  • http://tonyscott.org.uk/2008/08/16/links-for-2008-08-16/ Links for 2008-08-16 – tonyscott.org.uk

    [...] Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing ‘failed’ in the UK (or at least didn’t c… Guardian PDA responds with is there any money in UK blogging? [...]

  • http://win7blog.de/?p=61 Win7Blog.de – Der Windows 7 Blog » Windows 7 Blog von Microsoft

    [...] Taking the shine off: Why blog publishing ‘failed’ in the UK (or … [...]

  • amartin

    What do you think Mike, you’re a blogger in the UK?

  • http://www.stuartdredge.com Stuart Dredge

    @Nicholas Bond – “Some of us went to journalism college – and learnt how to write and spell. And then we worked on papers and magazines…. We didn’t just buy a nice new iBook, download some software, bore people with our self-obsessions and copy press releases.”

    What a ridiculous generalisation to make, even in jest.

    There are plenty of bloggers who started their careers as print journalists, complete with dusty bits of paper in a cupboard somewhere from journalism college. For that matter, there’s a lot of people who could now be classed as journalists/bloggers, writing for print publications, websites and blogs.

    Writing ‘bloggers’ off as self-obsessed amateurs is simply outdated. Those journalism courses you mention? They’ll have modules on blogging now, assuming there’s room amid the daily spelling tests. And in any case, the idea that a ‘proper’ journalism qualification in some way sets you above bloggers simply doesn’t make sense.

    I’ve subbed the copy of big-name Fleet Street journalists who couldn’t write for toffee, but had the knowledge and contacts to (justifiably) reach the top of their profession. Equally, I know bloggers whose command of grammar, punctuation and yes, writing leaves me open-mouthed. And everything between on both sides.

    Copy press releases? I’m glad no print journalists do that. Oh, hang on, they do. There are lazy writers in every medium, including print. If anything, many bloggers actually shun press releases, and can be incredibly rude to PR people when contacted (I think that’s just as silly an attitude, mind).

    The people who wrote for Shiny’s blogs came from every conceivable professional background. Some of us were trained journalists excited about this new form of publishing. Others had never written professionally before, but knew their subject inside out, or were simply amazing writers with unique styles.

    Right now, blogs are increasingly as good a source of new talent for ‘traditional’ media’ as journalism college. Maybe that’s why some print journalists see bloggers as a threat, and make comments like yours. Their employers don’t, though. They’re trying to poach the best bloggers left, right and centre.

    I’m sorry if this reply seems overly angry – but your tone was so patronising, and your generalisation so wrong. Perhaps it was just a joke, and I’m being overly defensive. But I’ve encountered this attitude lots, and it stinks.

    And in any case, bloggers use Eee PCs nowadays, not iBooks. You could at least get your facts straight while being rude to us…

  • http://www.azam.info/ Nadeem Azam

    That is an interesting dissection of the situation.

    As somebody who spent nearly a decade working as a journalist and proofreader in Old Media and somebody who has been earning a full-time income from New Media since 1997, including having our own blog at azam.info , I can see the advantages of both traditional journalistic writing and that of bloggers.

    I’m not writing about any blogger who has been featured on this page, but most blog writing I’ve seen lacks the research, rigour, tightness and quality of that in traditional press. Journalists with decades of experience regularly spend whole days researching and writing articles, and yet their editors will not publish them, because the work is not considered good enough. How many bloggers bin articles they have spent hours researching and writing because they consider them unworthy of publication?

    Because blogging lacks the editorial quality controls of Old Media, it will never be seen on an equal footing. And it will never be as successful in the UK as it ought to be.

  • http://danleach.co.uk/2008/08/18/the-bbc-vs-commercial-blogs/ The BBC vs. commercial blogs | danleach.co.uk

    [...] has published an article by Ashley Norris on why blog publishing has failed in the UK. addthis_url = [...]

  • Jonathan Weinberg

    Ok, I wasn’t going to comment, especially as Shiny still have invoices of mine to pay, but I can’t hold back after spending an hour reading all this pointless bile.

    I’m a ‘professional’ journalist for what it is worth. I have industry qualifications, I worked my way up from the bottom on a local newspaper when we didn’t even have a proper computer to type on.

    And I spent seven years working for the UK’s No1 newspaper in various roles, including senior online positions building its website into the cyber success it is now.

    But on the tech side of my career, I’ve seen countless kids (blimey, I’m only 30) think they can do print journalism and think they can blog or work online, just because they are young and like gadgets – or mostly want a few freebie toys and trips.

    Well, they can’t – and there’s no place here for many of their obvious comments. It adds nothing to a very interesting debate begun by Ashley and really shows them to be the children they are. (And please, have some guts to post your names. If you believe in what you say, why hide behind anonimity?)

    At the end of the day, many people think they can be journalists, and many people think they can be publishers. Only a few can, and only a smattering of those few will succeed to a decent level.

    Both Shiny and Pocket-Lint created great models but all businesses – in whatever industry – face hard times and face failure. Just look at what is happening to the banking sector, it’s a problem causing more problems for every one of us working within the media as advertisers shut their wallets and readers stop buying magazines or newspapers.

    Those who claim they know it all and could do better should go and try it, then they’ll realise just how hard it is.

    Since going freelance, I spent a good year working for Shiny, not just with Tech Digest but creating the Club Pies spin-offs that engaged, interested and yes, infuriated, readers in equal measure over season 2007/08. It wasn’t without problems or issues but I’m very proud my achievements in the sphere and especially proud of what my small team of writers achieved on budgets that fluctuated, designs that were poor and with a back-end that most Shiny writers will agree is not the best.

    I’ve my own deep thoughts on why many things worked and some things failed, and a lot of it on both sides has been expressed above by others so I won’t cut and paste ;-)

    As Stu D says, attacking each other might be fun, but it’s hardly professional. And in this game, only those who are professional will survive this current downturn, just like the first internet crash.

    I’ve known Ashley, Chris, Katie, Simon Munk and Stuart Miles for years now – and I am grateful for what they’ve taught me about the online world, blogging and the like, and I’m sure I’ve educated them in a few things too.

    Sharing ideas and experience – rather than bile – is the way for our industry to grow and the UK arm of it is a much better place for experienced people like those named above who had the guts to stand up and be counted.

    Long may they all continue while the rest throw mud and play in sandpits.

  • Niall Smith

    Man that started business which made money and continues to make money leaves business moaning about not winning business lottery.

    Group of people that all know each other start infighting over fear of dwindling pot of business lottery wins.

    How very web 1.0

    Businesses succeed and fail everyday, external investment is always hard to get and a profitable company that is stable and operating in a difficult climate is a success not a failure.

  • http://www.qualitynonsense.com/262/rockstar-bloggers-web-hosting/ Who Do Rockstar Bloggers Host With?

    [...] Another interesting read for bloggers: ““Why Blog Publishing ‘Failed’ in the UK” (via Here.org.uk). Share and [...]

  • http://fat-man-collective.com/publicbeta Adam Martin {Fat Man}

    At the end of the day, it’s all about CPM, that’s the business, one supported by engaging content. But when the site design is awful and the flashverts off-putting, what hope is there? We all know, nobody with any sense clicks on any of those damn things anyway and that the more technically savy (read: nerdy) use Firefox AdBlocker.

    Innovation in integrated advertising would be a step in the right direction, a focus on the visuals/design and context, a partnerhip between a network such as Shiny, the advertisers and ad creatives (yes us!!!).

    On Gawker & Co, it kinda works, Gawker Artist is a great innovation, sublimating the banner zone with art, thus encouraging further exploration of other banner areas where the real adverts reside. There is an overall design aesthetic that really really works.

    For too long tech and design creative have viewed each other with mutual distrust when, if they partnered up they’d realise their common interest was in working together to better woo the brands, ‘hey yeah we know our audience, let us design the adverts to go on the site?’.

    Google are doing this with Seth MacFarlane and Cavalcade.

    Let’s wake up and innovate, not bemoan US dominance.

  • http://www.blogstorm.co.uk/interviewed-by-the-bbc-about-the-british-blogging-industry/ Interviewed by the BBC about the British blogging industry

    [...] This morning I had a long chat with Rory Cellan-Jones from the BBC about the state of the UK blogging industry. In particular Rory wanted my thoughts on a recent TechCrunch post about why blogging is failing in the UK. [...]

  • annaitaly

    Shiny Media has posted a response on its blog, comments are held so I’ve posted it here.

    We founded Shiny Media as three freelance journalists back in 2004 and the sites were born out of a passion for the internet and a belief that established publishers just weren’t making enough of the medium. The early sites were launched because we loved blogs, we wanted to write about things that interested us, and we couldn’t find sites like Shoewawa and Shiny Shiny to write for.

    So we created those sites ourselves, and we quickly realised that we were on to something. We’d never set up a publishing company before, and there wasn’t a UK blogging business template we could follow, so a lot of what we’ve built up has been learned along the way.

    And we’ve certainly learned a lot since those early days of freelance. We now have a whole team of writers (eleven in house and many more freelance), some of whom have been with us since the very beginning. Fashion journalist and blogger Gemma Cartwright joined us back in November 2004 to start Shoewawa and The Bag Lady and now heads up our entire fashion team, bringing her own successful site, Catwalk Queen, with her. More recently, we have hired two more staff members this month, including Duncan, a staff writer on our oldest and biggest blog Tech Digest and Matt who joins us as an account manager, supporting our growing commercial team.

    Revenue is going up month on month and traffic has increased 26 per cent over the last 12 months. So it seems ‘rumours of our death’ to paraphrase Mark Twain have been greatly exaggerated.

    We read the article on Tech Crunch UK and the many comments below the feature and we thought we should respond to them here.

    Design – Perhaps one of the biggest criticisms of our sites is that their design makes them difficult to navigate around and load. We hold our hands up. In a mad land grab last year, like kids in a sweet shop, we launched a large number of blogs in many verticals. We had tonnes of ideas, plenty of passion, and we couldn’t believe that publishers weren’t about to launch their own networks any day. In our enthusiasm to get our ideas online we were far too stretched to deal with very real problems around technology and design. But we’ve been working hard fix that, and a lot has already been done behind the scenes. Sheldon and Jess – our design team – have worked hard on updating and cleaning templates, fixing bugs and dealing with the vagaries of the Movable Type content management system. But with over 30 sites to deal with it’s taken time. The good news is that we had scheduled in a redesign for September anyway (honestly we had). Please feel free to e-mail us on info@shinymedia.com with your thoughts and examples of sites you like that we can take on board.

    Advertising – As any publisher will tell you, there is always a fine line between advertising and editorial. Getting that balance right is a constant challenge and, while reader experience is and will remain our absolute priority, the commercial reality is that advertising is a necessary part of our business. We don’t just say yes to any advertising and work incredibly hard to maintain the balance. A key issue in our site re-design will be how advertising can be better integrated within the site without reducing the reader experience. Obviously an important concern of ours is the placement of Flash ads and the loading speed of the sites.

    Text-based content – Perhaps one of the things we are most proud of is our high quality content. That’s probably because of our backgrounds as trained journalists. Some of the comments criticised Shiny content, grumbling it wasn’t as good as it used to be. But that’s where we would have to disagree. We have some great writers on board, some of whom are trained journalists, some of whom have got into blogging by less formal means. To us it doesn’t really matter. If you can write, have something to say and people want to read it then that’s fine by us, and Katie has been there from the very beginning to keep an eye on everyone and set the Shiny tone.

    Although we got plenty of negative comments on the Tech Crunch article, we’ve had an awful lot more positive feedback from our readers. And while we’re always happy to take on board constructive criticisms, much of it seemed to stem from readers who just aren’t that into the Shiny style, which is fine – there’s plenty of space on the internet for everyone! We believe there are just as many bad print journalists out there as there are bad bloggers – though perhaps it’s true that more of them are hiding behind good sub-editors who are cleaning up their articles for them!

    Video-based content – For Shiny one of the most exciting new areas, and one where we have seen massive growth, is video. It is still very early days, but we think we are producing some great quality stuff. Sure it’s not broadcast quality but it’s entertaining, full of personality and informative content for the web user – in other words the very embodiment of Shiny values. Some people seem to think that we encourage our presenters to expose their cleavage which is just a ludicrous accusation! There really isn’t any dress code, nor will there ever be. If staff want to wear a polo neck, a smock or a burka then it’s entirely up to them.

    Finally, we do have our supporters. With such a gloomy intro to the Tech Crunch post, it’s not surprising that we attracted a lot of negative comments, and we’re certainly not dismissive of them. But there were positives too. There were people who felt we had achieved a lot in building a brand and an audience, and we thank them! We haven’t always got everything right, we know that, but we are working hard to deliver content that both readers and advertisers find compelling. We hope you’ll excuse our lack of British modesty when we say we think we’re doing pretty well at it!

  • http://www.23.test-na-iq.pl/technology/1236/can-brits-make-bucks-from-blogging Can Brits make bucks from blogging? | Technology, science, computers

    [...] of ace of Britain’s large commercial journal networks Shiny Media. Inwards a fascinating guest post on TechCrunch UK, Ashley Frank norris, who has just left the business concern atomic number 2 started inwards 2003, [...]

  • http://tonyscott.org.uk/2008/08/24/links-for-2008-08-24/ Links for 2008-08-24 – Tony Scott

    [...] Stately decline [Media Guardian] and the associated PDA post Kingswood Warren: The end of an era gives the background to BBC Kingswood Warren faces strike. [...]

  • http://curiouslypersistent.wordpress.com/2008/08/27/links-27th-august-2008/ Links – 27th August 2008 « Curiously Persistent

    [...] the British make money from blogging? The discussion started on Techcrunch UK, and then the BBC picked it up. An interesting debate, at least until the name-calling [...]

  • http://www.theredrocket.co.uk/blog/?p=117 » US trounce British blogs The Red Rocket: Altogether now, “reach for the sky”

    [...] have a combined Technorati rank of 18,404, while the British equivalents only total 1,304. Maybe Ashley Norris had a point after all when he bemoaned the state of British [...]

  • http://24newsmedia.com/2008/08/30/can-brits-make-bucks-from-blogging/ Can Brits make bucks from blogging? | 24NewsMedia.com International Online News

    [...] co-founder of one of Britain’s biggest commercial blog networks Shiny Media. In a fascinating guest post on TechCrunch UK, Ashley Norris, who has just left the business he started in 2003, explains why it is so much [...]

  • http://www.sea-english.com gonominorcub

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  • http://blogs.pressgazette.co.uk/wire/3749 Shiny Media shut down football blog, blaming lack of investment | The Wire | Press Gazette

    [...] co-founder Ashley Norris – who left the company last month – wrote a revealing post soon after on TechCrunch asking why UK blogs had yet to make the big bucks some of their US counterparts are bringing [...]

  • http://www.blogstorm.co.uk/why-uk-blog-networks-are-really-failing/ Why UK Blog Networks Are Really Failing

    [...] August TechCrunch UK published a post discussing why blog publishing is “failing” in the UK. Below are my somewhat belated thoughts on the issue, you can read more in a BBC interview I did [...]

  • http://uk.techcrunch.com/2009/02/06/and-then-there-was-one-shiny-media-slashes-staff-and-co-founder-departs/ And then there was one – Shiny Media slashes staff and co-founder departs

    [...] numbers. Meanwhile former co-founder Ashley Norris left last year, leaving behind a hotly debated parting shot about why the company did not mirror the success of other US-based blog starups. Moving Shiny [...]

  • http://blogs.journalism.co.uk/editors/2009/02/11/talking-to-shinykatie-post-shiny-shiny-can-turn-things-around/ Talking to (Shiny)Katie post-Shiny: ‘Shiny can turn things around’ | Journalism.co.uk Editors’ Blog

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  • http://uk.techcrunch.com/2009/07/21/uks-last-indie-blog-network-shiny-media-goes-into-administration/ UK’s largest indie blog network Shiny Media goes into administration

    [...] last year the company began to show cracks as former co-founder Ashley departed and subsequently penned a controversial bare-all guest post on TechCrunch Europe which attracted 120 comments. Tweet ThisTipSHARETHIS.addEntry({ title: [...]

  • http://thenextweb.com/2009/07/21/shiny-media-uks-answer-gawker-dead/ Shiny Media, The UK’s answer to Gawker, is Dead. – The Next Web

    [...] Chris Price, Katie Lee and Ashley Norris. Norris, left in 2008 and wrote a controversial piece on Techcrunch Europe discussing why blog publishing had already failed in the UK. Katie Lee left in [...]

  • http://www.sportsjournalists.co.uk/blog/?p=1966 Sports Journalists’ Association newsblog » Blog Archive » Shiny Media ‘in administration’ says founder

    [...] left the company in March this year, while another of the company’s co-founders, Ashley Norris, moved on last August, just before Who Ate All the Pies was closed down by [...]

  • http://www.newsjacker.co.uk/2009/07/21/updated-uk%e2%80%99s-largest-indie-blog-network-shiny-media-goes-into-administration/ Updated: UK’s largest indie blog network Shiny Media goes into administration | Newsjacker

    [...] year the company began to show cracks as former co-founder Ashley Norris departed and subsequently penned a controversial bare-all guest post on TechCrunch Europe which attracted 120 [...]

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  • http://andymerrett.co.uk/2009/07/22/shiny-media-and-me-the-show-must-go-on/ Shiny Media and me: the show must go on– Andy Merrett

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