How do you know if someone’s online profile is real? The question has plagued us for some time now, but it’s become increasingly problematic as vast swatches of the mainstream of society goes online and joins a social network, whether it be Twitter, Facebook, or whatever. The problem is of course rife on dating web sites.
One of the ways celebrities who arrived early on Twitter verified their profile was to Twitpic themselves in front of their Twitter profile. But now a new startup has taken this verification idea to its logical conclusion. CheckedProfile launches today in the US, but is actually the brainchild of long-time UK entrepreneur Ben Way, who is now based in Fort Lauderdale, Florida.
Here’s how it works.
You upload your profile picture. The site then provides a custom identifier that is unique to that picture. You then write the identifier on a sheet of paper and take a picture of yourself holding that page. With those two pictures uploaded and a flled-out CheckedProfile account, an “expert profile checker” verifies that the person in both images is the same. You are then free to use your CheckedProfile verified photograph any where you want to prove your real identity online. CheckedProfile is even looking to have other levels of verification such as date of birth, name and address, though I’m not quite sure how.
The sting is that while it’s free for women and children, it’ll be $1.99 for men. Additional photographs are $0.99 for everyone. “Priority verification” (verification in one hour or less) is $0.99 per photograph but normal E-mail address verification is free for all.
Sorry guys. I guess no-one really believe that online dating profile of yours, right? In fact, the site says over 80% of online daters have suspected that the profile images being used online are fakes and over a third have actually discovered that a person’s identity does not match that of their online persona. No. Kidding…
CheckedProfile claims it has patented this whole process – although to be honest it sounds pretty replicable. And what I don’t get is why they can’t apply a facial recognition technology to this process or perhaps crowd-source it – because having humans checking profile does not scale.
But Way insists that they “have an incredibly efficient back end” that takes on average 20 seconds to verify a photo, and that other facial recognition technologies are not up to the job yet. Plus, this is quite Mahalo-esque – trained checkers can work from home and get paid per check.
Update: I wasn’t previously aware of Validize which is more aimed at bloggers, but is an interesting contrast.
I don’t get how they justify charging men more.
It’s revenge for shirt laundering pricing.
“The sting is that while it’s free for women and children, it’ll be $1.99 for men.”
Can the author get a legal opinion on the legality of this?
Doing so would would elevate this posting from a pr piece.
What the hell could possibly be illegal about that pricing scheme?
Really white Republican Wall Street types should be charged the most, don’t you think?
Johny, first off the business idea is very good.
On the pricing:
As someone else pointed out, in some locations it is illegal to charge a woman more than a man for dry cleaning.
But at the same time, in bars and clubs there are different pricings as well.
I do not know why one is legal and the other not.
Salons often have different pricing for women and men. If they can do that why can’t CheckProfile?
I dunno, maybe because women usually take a lot more effort in a salon than a man. Of course there’s your aunt Billie and Uncle Fran, but in most cases women’s styles take more time to do than men’s. So, different prices.
women are prettier to look at?
(start team is probably mostly male??)
Either that or it’s just one really creepy guy who likes pictures of women and children.
Sounds a little far-fetched, especially if all it is doing is verifying your face.
http://www.honestyonline.com/ is already doing what these guys are hoping to do.
Quite far-fetched. http://www.validize.com provides a much better solution.
I say stick with the old method. It free and works exactly the same. Why pay for what you can do free?
I have one word for them: Photoshop.
So let me get this right, at the end you get a verified image you can use? So what is stopping bots locating and downloading all “verified” images they can find?
Just to come back on a few of your points :
Charging men more, this is a little like charging men more for insurance; the reality is that men a far more likly to try and fake their picture for immoral purposes than woman are.
http://www.honestyonline.com/ does not check your photos checkedprofile is more of a mass market product and hence the price point is significantly less.
Photoshop/downloading other verified pictures; this does not work because we run a closed loop system which means that your photo is linked to a profile; so when somebody checks a photo they can also enter your username for the site they are trying to check and confirm that is the username attached to that photo.
As for sticking to the old method, in certain circumstances(such as dating) you want to use your best picture; http://www.checkedprofile.com allows you to do that the old method does not.
But thanks for your interest!
Ben
“Charging men more, this is a little like charging men more for insurance;”
How so?
Its based upon risk, the risk of a man having a crash is greater than a woman, therefore insurance costs more for men.
The same for us; the risk of having a man try and game the system is greater than a woman; so we charge men and woman get it for free.
Ben Way,
Are you saying that if someone beats your validation system you pay damages to anyone who was fooled and relied on your system?
Hey Jud,
No actually we are saying the opposite all systems are fallible and you must always use your common sense; this just lowers the risk of you meeting somebody fake.
We have considered almost like an insurance policy in case you do meet up with someone who has gone through our system; but it is something we are reviewing as it is very hard to implement.
Because men are generally better in Photoshop..
Oh please, women are much more likely to fake photos. Myspaces angles anyone?
Actually from our research woman are much less likely to use fake photos, they tend to use old photos of themselves.
Hi Ben,
You are incorrect, Honestyonline.com already partnered with Datingheadshots Inc. ( datingheadshots.com ) to create a full proof system to verify a persons identity and photo together. The end result is a verified credential that can be combined with the persons true photo and used not only on online dating sites but where ever the credential is accepted.
I believe that your basic notion of verified profiles is correct and admirable and would eliminate many of the problems with online dating fraud. I’m concerned that you are offering a false sense of security whether it be for $1.99 or $199 since this process is to easy to circumvent.
Thanks Gorden,
We don’t claim to do anything else but verify the photo so I don’t think it a false sense of security; this tends to be the item people are most worried about according to our research.
Soon we will be able to match a photo to almost any piece of data just like honesty online; but seriously have you gone through their sign up process; its hard work and still can be abused. Remember no technology is ever 100% secure you can only do things to lower your risk.
Ben, let me get this straight. Our process, where you fill in a few online forms, is hard work. Your process, where you take a photo of yourself, upload it, fill out a form, write down a code on a piece of paper, take another picture of yourself holding the piece of paper, upload it, and wait for an email confirming verification — is not.
Larry Cynkin
CTO, honestyonline.com
Hi Larry,
Actually I think they both have flaws and are really for different purposes, I found yours particular intensive because you are trying to verify against a database; I know how hard this is because we are implementing similar procedures for our different levels.
CheckedProfile level 1 was only ever designed as a quick instant way to verify photos, I think we achieve this(next revision will be even easier)
But look this is a rapidly expanding market, and I believe in cooperation over competition lets have a chat about it, you know where to contact me.
> Charging men more, this is a little like
> charging men more for insurance;
> the reality is that men a far more likly to
> try and fake their picture for immoral
> purposes than woman are.
I have zero samples of men doing this, since I don’t date men, but this happens plenty with women. It’s extremely common for women to post pictures online that show themselves 5 or even 10 years ago, and in addition to that lie about their age.
As I said above woman tend to have issues with their age not identity;
Men have a much higher risk of using fake photos all together.
Not to put a to finer point on it but a man walking into a situation where he meets somebody 10 years older than he is expecting is a LOT less risky than a woman meeting a complete stranger.
Oh C’mon, it’s the ladies night of online profiles. Let the ladies in for free and the fellows will follow.
>> And what I don’t get is why they can’t apply a facial recognition technology to this process
The same reason I don’t get why you just don’t build a robot to write your blog posts for you. Clearly that’s more scalable.
Actually that’s not so hard to do. It’s all up the quality you are looking for for the site and anyone can do it. They are called scrapers. There are plenty of those as WordPress blogs!
They’re just using Amazon Turk. It’s automated. Pay someone .10 to check the images, keep $1.89. Plenty scalable.
you all know we’re definitely at the end of the cycle and headed for a crash when start-ups like this begin to pop up.
Charging only men … I doubt that will last long. What happened to eHarmony could as easily happen with CheckedProfile.com, especially because they are in the US and because of the non-discrimination laws of the US.
It is like getting your photo attested as attested true copy by a gazetted officer in British Raj in India.
But then there is photoshop. That can be an answer to it.
How do they check that I am a man?
You have to write a number they give you on your genitalia and send over the picture.
Charging men only? This sketches me out a bit.
-Daniel Contogiannis
Photoshop cannot break the system, remember that the photo you upload with the unique code is confidential you would have to have 2 preprepared photo of somebody holding up a blank piece of paper and a profile picture of them and then paste the code onto it; which would mean effectively the person in the pictures would be giving you permission to use their identity to use.
Photoshop can trick this thing easily. What prevent you from claiming the identity of any other person? you send another person pic, then you Photoshop as if this person took a pic with the secret code and voila: you are identified with somebody else picture. and i hope he will be prettier.
They just verify the picture, but I can actually use the Mike Butcher name if I please.
Until they do something with government issued form of identifications, I guess they will apply just to dating sites..
Patented… this cannot be patented as there is a number of sites already using those techniques. I remember a photo contest site in Bulgaria that uses this approach.
Somehow I’m missing how this would prove anything… I’ve used sites that require members to pay for a background check to confirm identity. I’m not saying that things need to go that far but the photo method is ridiculous.
On dating sites especially, men use fake photos to lure woman into meeting them; I have heard this story a hundred times over.
What this proves is the person on the dating site is the person they say they are in the picture.
So for example if you had been speaking to a guy on a dating site and were thinking about meeting him you could ask him to go through the process and give you his unique verification ID.
fail.
I’m sorry but this service is stupid. For regular people it can only verify the people are using real pictures of themselves. But so what if the pictures are right? It doesn’t verify any information people on their profiles, right? So how is that really useful?
Besides, this would’ve been nice if this can check if some supposedly celebrity is really behind a Twitter or Facebook account. For example I’ve seen Lee Kaifu’s (head of Google China) profile on Facebook and have doubts about if it’s really him. Either way, why would Lee bothers with it???
So at the end, this service cannot verify if you’re really dealing with a celebrity (or public figure of some sort) or the person is telling anything true about him/herself…
Let’s see how fast this goes into the deadpool…
I love people trying to be entrepreneur and come up with great ideas that can make big or small changes in our lives. And then there are people who do totally useless things like this.
Sorry to be harsh but I’m just saying it bluntly…
Oh no I like a good debate; this is a beta it is to learn what works and what does not in this field; obviously identity verification online is going to be a big part of our digitial identies this is just a small step into it; we are working on various products in this space; based on my background you should know that this is the way I work; we put high risk products into market some work some don’t; some we have to modify.
And while currently it does nothing more than verify a picture(and in dating sites this is a really useful thing to be able to do) soon it will be able to verify any piece of information you submit.
Also for instance if Lee Kaifu did it; you would have to believe that a person who looks exactly like Lee is trying to impersonate Lee; a very unlikely scenario.
As I say on the site this is not to stop all situations where identity can be abused it is just another tool to help.
It has already exceeded my expectations I was thinking that today mostly woman would sign up but actually more men have and have actually paid; that really has surprised me.
good seeing that you can take criticism in stride.
forget the celebrities for a minute… let’s just focus on the regular joes who will (or won’t) be your customers.
say i post a profile on bonypeopledating.com and claim to be a millionaire and drive a lamburghini. my point previously is that you can verify the photo i use but so what? for women who are debating if they should meet me in person… your service doesn’t protect them from any false information I may claim on the Internet…
unless of course they only care about how I look…
or maybe you could change the name of your service to “checkedphoto.com?” =P
it’s late at night where i am and missed reading the second paragraph…
i’d be kinda interested to find out how you plan to verify personal information or if people would bother to go through whatever procedures there are.
say you have some way to verify. what is the incentive for people to pay to verify if he’s telling the truth about himself? (obviously a guy who’s not telling the truth about himself won’t bother with it…) to get a better chance of hooking up? hmm….. not sure if it will sell…
Charging only men? What if all men claim to be women?
I can hardly believe there isn’t a better way to do this kind of verification than the archaic way described.
When we verify we check if it is a man or a woman and what they signed up as if it does not match we reject them.
Trust me we looked through all the options, the only automated way to do it would have meant an unacceptable 60% failure rate.
It will come but ROI is not worth it at the moment; I am keeping ahead of developments in the field.
Ben
Ben, what on Earth made you think of this idea?
I have done a huge amount of work in the dating industry; it is crying out for a simple instant way to verify somebody’s picture.
We will be directly integrating with dating sites; so this will be an optional component to registration or an added option later.
Our research indicates that there is a significantly greater chance of a woman meeting a man if she can be sure that it is a real photo of him.
Why not charge all people; why discriminate against men
What qualifies as a child in some countries it can either be anyone under 18, 20 or 21
Its not about discrimination it is about risk; having said that we may well change our pricing model in the future, we make make it free we may charge for both; that is the whole point of a beta!
We do not accept children at the moment as that is more complicated and requires additional protection layers; we are working on it.
I’v seen a lot of PHP generated pictures like those you ask for validate an identity.
This remind me a recently scamm case published at eugeniadiordiychuk.com, an erotic model fan site in witch you can get a dedicated picture of this model holding a piece of paper with your nick in it. So the most skilled photoshoper wins the “Katie Fey” identity. Have fun
Actually we have built one of those in the past; but our system detects duplicate pictures; so whereas the first picture would be authorized the rest would not be; and again you will still be using that persons identity with their permission.
But this kind of pictures can actually pass your control process. Scammers don’t care about permission and there’s a lot of pictures of people holding pieces of paper out there.
Yes but you need two pictures of the same person, one holding a piece of paper; getting this is not easy and then it will be linked to a credit card…..like I said above no system is 100% infallible; but personally I believe this reduces risk massively for the people using it.
It’s good to see a fellow entrepreneur trying to solve a real problem.
Unfortunately, while CheckedProfile might make it more difficult to use false pictures, herein lies the problem, a level of authenticity is implied for all checked pictures (especially after charging).
However, given the vast number of images available online and what is possible with Photoshop the system can be beaten.
Therefore it will be difficult to ask users to pay for a verification service without any level of guarantee.
Step 1) Send in a picture of someone you want to impersonate.
Step 2) Take your picture with the secret code, and photoshop their face onto it.
Step 3) …There is no step 3.
Photoshop for the win!
Its even easier than that Takeshi. Most people these days upload their own proof pics to websites where they are holding up a piece of paper with their username for that site on. All you need to do is submit one of their normal pics, get the code, then photoshop the code onto the pic where they are holding up the paper. Then you become them, haha. This is a silly idea. Maybe with the advent of webcams in the future these sites will use that to take a snap of new members. Its too much hassle this way, and the system can be gamed very easily.
Fraudsters are much more likely to post as females on dating sites.
True. Most dating scams involve girls pretending to be Russian/Nigerian hotties. Check out here – top 5 scammers are women.
The problem here Ben, is that if your system validate only one scammer, you can get in troubles for supporting them, after all, it is you the one saying they are authentic and the victims can reach you easier than they can get to the scammers.
There seems to be a lot of pent up aggression on TC at the moment.
Not saying I’m a particular fan of this idea, but I have to give credit to someone who puts himself out there and engages in dialogue with the angry hordes…
WOW….. another epic fail by Ben Way. Everything this guy ‘launches’ seems to further clarify how stupid he is.
Gonna be adding this one to the wikipedia profile Ben?
I think this is much needed in the dating scene. Not only for men to be authentic, but for women.
I have used online dating for over the past 7 years, and I can tell you people LOVE the ANGLE PICTURE.
Not only do people tend to show the BEST photo of what they look like, sometimes they say who they are not.
I have gone to blind dates where I thought their photo was completely different then who they really were…. this is a good filter against those ugly bettys
either way… I will def test this out. Its only 2 bucks lol… these people are retarded lol
Is this Ben guy dumb or what,this so called start up is 10 years behind the pace……….ahh i know youv’e just come out of space from 1999 and landed back in in fort Lauderdale well it’s 2009 now Ben ,things have now moved on………you won’t be going back to sapce but the deadpool i’m afraid.
Dumb epic fail; I love it; but seriously guys I have thick skin, I have been doing this a long long time….but really on a general note it is a very strange society that tries to bring down entrepreneurs in one of the hardest economic downturns in history.
We may not always get it right, and entrepreneurs are not infallible; but we do work hard and try hard, when I set out with CheckedProfile in mind of course I had a commercial view of it; but primarily I wanted to make the internet a safer place for woman dating on the internet.
I know, as all well known people do, that some people will hate you just for being who you are, all I ask these people is that they confront me directly; rather than hide behind the internet to take out their frustrations, talk to me.
CheckedProfile is a beta product, I am all for constructive criticism; but people generally who look at only the bad without considering the good and be destructive rather than creative are missing the key to life.
I am 28, I have 17 active companies, most of which will survive the economic downturn, I live in an amazing condo overlooking the beach, I spend my weekends on my Yacht, I have amazing friends and every morning I wake up looking forward to the day ahead; if this is a dumb epic failure, I truly can’t wait for success.
Lol I bet they are the ones that feel like dumb failures now
don’t forget about the accent
.
Wait! http://www.honestyonline.com/ says you live in a refrigerator box overlooking the west-end Arby’s and sail your rusty bathtub on Mondays. We need some verification here.
Hi Ben,
Stay strong. Critics are made to make you and your service better.
We are few miles away. Maybe we’ll get a chance to meet and discuss it over.
Take care.
Florian
Hey Ben .. i didnt know .. you are tat successful … lol .. well thats grt .. U have already achieved a lot .. at 28 which is next to impossible for most of the ppl .. who call u dumb or whatever .. and u took that seriously .. chill .. dnt mind what they are saying .. thats how they think .. and this is how much they can think .. thats their level of thinkng ..Chill and feel like Bret Pitt .. You are a celebrity .. Ppl are discussing you ..
This HUGE string of comments shows that this is obviously an area that has a lot of interest, so Ben is obviously on to something. For all the people trying to sling mud at the idea, I hope they are sat there with a long line of successful entrepreneurial ventures under their belts.
Strong pilot data already appears to prove there is a market for this service, and the fact that there are a couple of other services in the space (albeit different) shows there is a market.
If you don’t like it…jog on. If you do, use it. Simple really.
Simon
All you need is Photoshop and you can verify any picture you like using their “stamp”
Great idea Ben,
But in a world of increasing movement towards making no inequalities or distinctions between people my feeling is you charge everyone or no-one.
Good luck with your venture
Richard
Hey Ben, landed here from your twitter page, looks like a great idea – as with all true great successes it is the challange of translating the idea into a tangible (and ultimately profitable) outcome. Shame about the so many people trying to shoot you down, imagine the difference that could be made to the world had great ideas not disappeared into the pits of anti-encouragement…. ah well.
Mr Way you are indeed a legend! Love the fact that these few people think they have the ability/right to analyse a business. I wonder what their analysis is based on? I bet they have lots of ideas they brag to their friends about in bars but that they never act upon. How many businesses have they tried to set up let alone had the balls to give it a shot and run with?
What Ben has is a (very good) idea turned into a real service, market research to back it up, vast sector experience and a beta site. A bloody good platform to launch a business from.
Don’t call Ben dumb, he really isn’t! As Ben says no business is a “cert” but this is a lot better than many that suceed.
Even if this does make a gazillion dollars, it may allow a few people to fall in love safe in the knowledge that the person they are going to meet is genuine. Or it will stop some people posting pictures that aren’t genuine with the only hope of luring a potential partner to a meeting they wouldn’t have otherwise gone to.
So…. a good idea with decent social benefits too. Stop moaning people, get a hobby or a girlfriend/boyfriend. Hey maybe you could even try and start a business, in 6 months I bet you wouldn’t all be so negative! It isn’t easy.
Best of luck Ben, if anyone can do it you can pal.
Luke
I’m 16 and even I’m smart enough to understand that this is a great idea,
Of course everyone has the right/ability to critique the business. They will be the ones using it. No one is knocking him for trying to help women online, but they are knocking the idea because to be honest it’s way behind. If he had come up with some new technology to make this very easy, cool, but with the method he’s using, its too much trouble to do and it’s so easily gamed it won’t be trusted. Therefore even when you see a profile pic has been checked, you still will have doubts. I’ll game it with two fake pictures to prove my point. So really it will actually help the fakes because they’ll be the ones who end up using this as another method to pull the wool over someones eyes.
I’m 16 and even I’m smart enough to understand that this is a great idea, it IS a BETA and its already making sales if you read through the comments on here of people who use dating sites they seem to think its a decent idea I guess all the other guys who don’t understand have never used dating sites probably because you lack self confidence, and I’m sure dating sites will spend a lot of money advertising on the site because of the amount of people coming from dating sites.
At the end of the day you can either hide in the background or get yourself out there with thick skin. Everyone who has succeeded in business has done the latter…
There’s no doubt that this is a needed service, whether it’ll work is beyond me, I don’t know enough about it to judge. However for those slating Ben on a personal level it seems they have a bit of the green-eyed monster.
It amazes me how bitchy TC can become!
I really like this idea. I personally can see why the price differential is an issue with alot of people here- it is clearly explained on the checkprofile website.
Although, I am personally a little bit sceptical about the use of cartoons to promote a security feature.
I’ll be using it though!
I really like this idea. I personally can’t see why the price differential is an issue with alot of people here- it is clearly explained on the checkprofile website.
Although, I am personally a little bit sceptical about the use of cartoons to promote a security feature.
I’ll be using it though!
Ben, you could have the best website in the world and if the first couple of comments on an article like this are negative, the rest will follow.
Being 25 myself and involved with three businesses, I agree that there should be a better support system in this country for (ethical and forward thinking) entrepreneurs.
I don’t think anyone has issues with Ben, just the implementation of what he’s trying to do. This is such an obvious way if it was a viable business someone would’ve already done this.
My main point is that I can see this business *helping’ fakes fool the other person. Whenever I see a checked profile I’ll just be thinking they’ve gone that extra mile to trick me by paying for this service. Sure, some will use it genuinely, but people who know they are who they say they are won’t be too worried about being called out as a fake. The fakes on the other hand… well..
isn’t that statement so infuriating, “if it was a viable business someone would’ve already done this” it is people like Ben who continue to innovate and push us forward. do you think if Ben had listened to that statement when he was 15 he would have become one of the UK’s richest men?
you would be amazed at how many people lack common sense. just because something is obvious doesn’t mean everyone will see it for what it is.
This has been a problem for years, and the website he has built deals with it in a way many people would’ve thought of before, in fact I’ve got men to send me a mobile pics with the word I stated written on a piece of paper. This method is actually more full proof than Bens because I’m specifying the word real time. So this certainly isn’t innovative Leon. Not in the way its implemented, anyway.
I know about Ben, I’m British too. He is obviously smart, but he was in the right place at the right time regarding his first successes – before the first internet bubble burst. Of course I wish him good luck, but looking at the business, not Ben, I don’t see it taking off. We shall see though.
And how do they know that the second upload picture is not a photoshoped version?